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Old 04-23-2017, 01:29 PM
Almed Almed is offline

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Default Some plans I had for an Ultimate Warcraft.

I posted about a reboot. Later, I started throwing around pitches to do a Warcraft version of Marvel's Ultimates (carried over into the current films).

We Start In Draenor

Draenor is a harsh continent on a currently nameless world. The indigenous civilizations are the Orcs, Ogres, Arrakoa, and Draenei. As you'd expect, there are wars over territory in this world.

Now along comes the Burning Legion, effectively led by Kil'Jaeden. The Legion leader had his attention drawn by the Draenei's feats in the arcane. Seeing some dandy recruits, KJ conspires to put chaos in the world to recruit them (and other Draenor groups worth getting). He exploits conflicts among the Draenorlings until some Orcs of the Shadowmoon Clan or their predecessors beseech help from the ancestors. KJ and some demons show up in disguise to grant them the power to crush their enemies (actually demonic magic and techniques) for a magical pact binding the clan to the Legion.

And so, the Orcs who did the pact rallied the Orcs who'd help them with showings of magic that surely rivaled the Draenei (if not outdoing them). They forged a new force: THE HORDE.

More in another post...
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Old 04-23-2017, 01:48 PM
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Interesting, are you separating the Draenei and Eredar as species?
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Old 04-23-2017, 04:05 PM
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I currently have the Draenei as their post-TBC goatman version but more "primitive." Kinda like in the movie. But with magic crystals.
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Old 04-23-2017, 04:19 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Almed View Post
I currently have the Draenei as their post-TBC goatman version but more "primitive." Kinda like in the movie. But with magic crystals.
Nice, what's KJ look like then?
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Old 04-23-2017, 04:25 PM
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Just go with his WC2 look.
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Old 04-23-2017, 05:02 PM
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Just go with his WC2 look.
Ah, this one?

https://s-media-cache-ak0.pinimg.com...82097001c0.jpg

Nice, though I still think the WC3 humanoid-ish art of him fits 'deceiver' archetype best.

What're your plans for the other orcs?
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Old 04-23-2017, 06:59 PM
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Going from the clans who were important or sorta important in Warlords of Draenor:

Blackrock Clan-Just like in the old continuity, the big kahuna (at least in public) of Orcs. Their name comes from holding a monopoly on coal. When they set eyes on a dark mountain in Azeroth, they quickly lay claim to it.

Shadowmoon Clan-The holy men of Orcs. The first Orcs to get the support of their clan's ancestors. These Orcs maintain contact with the demons of the Twisting Nether, the demons sending them instructions. Ner'zhul is the newest leader among them with Gul'dan being the scheming rookie we all know. Even before the Legion met them they were infamous for their necromancy.

Warsong Clan-You know them. The warmongers of a horde of warmongers. During the Glorious War of Orcish Conquest (all the warring Orcs did on the other inhabitants of Draenor) they charged all comers.

Shattered Hand Clan-The wacky hand smashers. Their legends tell of having been slaves of the long passed Ogre Empire.
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Old 04-23-2017, 07:10 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Almed View Post
Going from the clans who were important or sorta important in Warlords of Draenor:

Blackrock Clan-Just like in the old continuity, the big kahuna (at least in public) of Orcs. Their name comes from holding a monopoly on coal. When they set eyes on a dark mountain in Azeroth, they quickly lay claim to it.

Shadowmoon Clan-The holy men of Orcs. The first Orcs to get the support of their clan's ancestors. These Orcs maintain contact with the demons of the Twisting Nether, the demons sending them instructions. Ner'zhul is the newest leader among them with Gul'dan being the scheming rookie we all know. Even before the Legion met them they were infamous for their necromancy.

Warsong Clan-You know them. The warmongers of a horde of warmongers. During the Glorious War of Orcish Conquest (all the warring Orcs did on the other inhabitants of Draenor) they charged all comers.

Shattered Hand Clan-The wacky hand smashers. Their legends tell of having been slaves of the long passed Ogre Empire.
Sounds good, definitely like that the Shadowmoon actually have non-pure-evil shadow magic even before Legion contact.


What about the Frostwolves?

Also, are you taking suggestions? I had a thought for Lightnings Blade, and Thunderlords.
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Old 04-23-2017, 07:46 PM
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Not seriously different from canon (hardy Orcs who ride wolves or a wolf analogue who got exiled thanks to Shadow Council plotting). As for requests, I can see them then maybe do them.
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Old 04-23-2017, 08:01 PM
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Not seriously different from canon (hardy Orcs who ride wolves or a wolf analogue who got exiled thanks to Shadow Council plotting). As for requests, I can see them then maybe do them.
Makes sense.

Lightnings Blade idea: Blademaster predecessors, similar to burning blade, but due to being an offshoot of the Thunderlord are also some of the only orcs to use polearms and spears.

Thunderlord: Still 'the hunter' clan, but instead of being specialized to wolves like the frostwolves they use a more general assortment of beasts and lure enemies to spots high in mountains where their shaman can hit them with lightning.
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Old 04-23-2017, 11:53 PM
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I see you have a lot of things similar to my work. Not that it is a bad thing.
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Old 04-24-2017, 07:30 PM
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The Draenei Flee

The Horde initially formed from the Shadowmoon, Blackrock, and Warsong Clans. Through decades or so of successful victories against their enemies, more Orcs were drawn to the fold. Ogres who hadn't already joined were beaten down, the Arrakoa were crushed, and then there's the Draenei.

The Draenei are inventive arcane enthusiasts. Through their studies into the chaos of arcane magic (expecially in travel between the worlds), they accidentally draw the attention of the Legion while at war with the. Kil'Jaeden with some other demons appear to collection of prominent Draenei to bring them into the fold. Among them, and the first, one Archimonde, a man who made a name for himself in battle against the Greenskins. However, there was a Draenei holy man who in his wisdom could not be talked into demonhood: Velen.

Seeing the danger in their benefactor, Velen preached to stay away. Seeing a lost cause, he rallied those Draenei who listened to flee away from both the Orcs and their demonic brethen. Using looted Orc research with their magic, they flee to Azuremyst where they build an expedition camp. Archimonde and his fellow demons travel through a constructed portal into the Twisting Nether where KJ showers them with honors. The Draenei who did neither were either dragged into slave labor or went into hiding.
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Old 04-25-2017, 08:55 PM
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Centuries

The Horde reigns in Draenor. The Draenei as a threat have long faded away. The Arrakoa have been subjugated. They're the men. But for one thing: There's nothing left to conquer.

In the Twisting Nether, KJ has learned some interesting news. His long lost lord Sargeras is now using a human by the name of Medivh as his body. He speaks to KJ about a plot to devour Azeroth's arcane and regain a non-human body. KJ agrees and proceeds to tell Sargdivh about Draenor. Sargdivh later makes contact with Gul'dan during a vision, forming a deal.

Using instructions from the demons and the Shadowmoon's own work on portals, they construct a portal that can go back and forth (unlike a past attempt among the Draenei which was one way). Scouts are sent into this lush world, reporting back that they find. And so Elwynn is raided for a couple years, bringing home goods and women to be used as bargaining chip to convince more clans to cooperate.
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Old 04-25-2017, 09:00 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Almed View Post
Centuries

The Horde reigns in Draenor. The Draenei as a threat have long faded away. The Arrakoa have been subjugated. They're the men. But for one thing: There's nothing left to conquer.

In the Twisting Nether, KJ has learned some interesting news. His long lost lord Sargeras is now using a human by the name of Medivh as his body. He speaks to KJ about a plot to devour Azeroth's arcane and regain a non-human body. KJ agrees and proceeds to tell Sargdivh about Draenor. Sargdivh later makes contact with Gul'dan during a vision, forming a deal.

Using instructions from the demons and the Shadowmoon's own work on portals, they construct a portal that can go back and forth (unlike a past attempt among the Draenei which was one way). Scouts are sent into this lush world, reporting back that they find. And so Elwynn is raided for a couple years, bringing home goods and women to be used as bargaining chip to convince more clans to cooperate.
Looks good so far, though the wording in the bolded portion has me puzzled.

I'm also not sure the orcs would really need much to get them to cooperate if it's got goods and people to pillage, seems like they'd jump at the chance and the harder task would be reigning them in.
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Old 04-27-2017, 04:56 AM
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I meant "they're the man" as in, "you're the man."

Anyway, here are some worldbuilding tidbits:

1. There is no Fel. While there are magics associated with demons like Fire that might have their drawbacks, they aren't rooted in some opposing magic fuel from Arcane. I'm doing more of an RTS approach where there isn't really a sure gap between magic practiced by the likes of the Kirin Tor and the Burning Legion.

2. Calia is Anduin's mother and Varian's wife. Not only does this answer the question of what Calia's status post-Scourge in a less rushed way (killed in riot), but also provides the now Stormwind centered an Allaince an agenda to conquer Lordaeron by the start of WoW.

3. Thrall's Horde rejects Arcane Arts. Seeing that the Horde's dabbling in the Arcane Arts not only blew up their world, but made them suffer from some side-effects of getting cut off after years of snorting magic crack, Thrall declares they will pursue other sources.

4. Medivh never comes back from eating steel.
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Old 04-27-2017, 05:33 AM
Marthen Marthen is offline

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Quote:
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I'm doing more of an RTS approach where there isn't really a sure gap between magic practiced by the likes of the Kirin Tor and the Burning Legion.
I don't have a problem with your approach (it's your work after all), but I do not think this was ever the case in the RTS games. The Warcraft III strongly differentiated between the natural magics of Azeroth, which were nurturing and life-giving, and the chaos magics (also called the warlock magics or demonic power), which were described as "powers of entropy and destruction". Same with Warcraft II and I, really.
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Old 04-27-2017, 06:20 AM
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I don't have a problem with your approach (it's your work after all), but I do not think this was ever the case in the RTS games. The Warcraft III strongly differentiated between the natural magics of Azeroth, which were nurturing and life-giving, and the chaos magics (also called the warlock magics or demonic power), which were described as "powers of entropy and destruction". Same with Warcraft II and I, really.
I point you to Archimonde's speech before he wrecks Dalaran, where he calls out the wizards for using what he calls their (that is, the Legion's) flames. And the Blood Mage's hot magic being called demonic according to TFT's manual.
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Old 04-27-2017, 07:04 AM
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I point you to Archimonde's speech before he wrecks Dalaran, where he calls out the wizards for using what he calls their (that is, the Legion's) flames. And the Blood Mage's hot magic being called demonic according to TFT's manual.
Archimonde's speech seems nothing but bravado really, seeing how that directly contradicts the manual, and how the manual presents demonic hunger for magic and their claims to it. And The Frozen Throne's manual says nothing of sorts, it says some people believe it to be demonic, plus it also says they have abandoned the magics of the Kirin Tor.
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Old 04-27-2017, 05:12 PM
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I point out that the TFT manual lists frost and water as Kirin Tor magic. Yet we have Liches.
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Old 04-28-2017, 03:04 AM
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I point out that the TFT manual lists frost and water as Kirin Tor magic. Yet we have Liches.
I do not want to plague your beautiful thread further, so I am going to move this to the general lore section.
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Old 04-28-2017, 10:51 PM
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Alright. Move it then.

Continuing:

The Coming of War

In Draenor, the Orcs were plotting war after over a decade of raiding and trade with Azerothians. After some discussion the Orcish leaders agreed to go forward on the invasion (and with some prodding from demons acting on Sargdivh's orders), with the Warsong rushing for the portal.

Over in Azeroth, Stromwind and Ironforge's rulership was surely aware of the Greenskins. Since the Orcs weren't just hostile, there was discussion over how to handle them. There was a crowd among them who maintained the Orcs could be spoken to with terms reached. That is, until the Horde swarmed out of the portal.

After some discussion, it was decided that Stormwind would go to war. King Llane requested the aid of Ironforge in their war. Ironforge's leadership agreed to it.
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Old 04-28-2017, 11:28 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Almed View Post
I meant "they're the man" as in, "you're the man."

Anyway, here are some worldbuilding tidbits:

1. There is no Fel. While there are magics associated with demons like Fire that might have their drawbacks, they aren't rooted in some opposing magic fuel from Arcane. I'm doing more of an RTS approach where there isn't really a sure gap between magic practiced by the likes of the Kirin Tor and the Burning Legion.

2. Calia is Anduin's mother and Varian's wife. Not only does this answer the question of what Calia's status post-Scourge in a less rushed way (killed in riot), but also provides the now Stormwind centered an Allaince an agenda to conquer Lordaeron by the start of WoW.

3. Thrall's Horde rejects Arcane Arts. Seeing that the Horde's dabbling in the Arcane Arts not only blew up their world, but made them suffer from some side-effects of getting cut off after years of snorting magic crack, Thrall declares they will pursue other sources.

4. Medivh never comes back from eating steel.

All excellent points, though I'd like to see 3 change over time and chaos magic still be its own thing but not as blatantly hyper-corruptive and overpowered as Fel.

EDIT: To clarify, The Tuskarr in current WoW see arcane as part of the natural world/universe, would you keep that aspect of it in your version or would arcane be a wholly otherworldly magic?

And would green flame still be a recognizable brand of specialization, though not necessarily retaining fel's more extreme traits?
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Last edited by Mutterscrawl; 04-28-2017 at 11:31 PM.. Reason: Clarify
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Old 04-29-2017, 04:18 PM
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I list Arcane as manipulating the chaotic forces of creation for your purposes, as opposed to working in and maintaining harmony with them (druidism), appeasing them for favors (shamanism), or drawing from one's inner force (light). Green flame is a more demonic method.

Last edited by Almed; 04-30-2017 at 01:33 AM..
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Old 05-05-2017, 09:35 PM
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War Burns

The Horde marched from the Dark Portal, laying waste to its opposition (early on, anyway). The alliance between Stormwind and Ironforge of course retailiated, deploying their forces against the green menace.

All wasn't well among the Orcs. You see, there was a faction among them that didn't appreciate the overly big role the Shadow Council (a ruling party of spellcasters drawn largely from Shadowmoon but also from other clans) was taking. A key member being Orgrim, a Blackrock Orc who descends from the Thunderlords maternally. This faction wouldn't get their time to purge the Horde until later.

Meanwhile Sargdivh was carrying out his plot to drain the land. He might have gotten away with it if his apprentice Khadgar hadn't exposed him. A strike force that included one Garona broke into his tower with the warlock dying in battle.

This had a backlash effect on Gul'dan, knocking him into a coma. Just then, Orgrim staged a coup against Blackhand in the wake of a disaste in battle. Blackhand is killed and beheaded.

Orgrim is quick to declare his rule.

Last edited by Almed; 05-05-2017 at 09:39 PM..
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Old 05-08-2017, 07:28 AM
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Any suggestions?
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