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  #651  
Old 10-06-2017, 08:35 AM
Kakwakas Kakwakas is offline

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It seems that the people most resistant to reality and adhering to ideological fantasy despite all manner of facts to the contrary tend to be religious, though.
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  #652  
Old 10-06-2017, 09:16 AM
BaronGrackle BaronGrackle is offline

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It seems that the people most resistant to reality and adhering to ideological fantasy despite all manner of facts to the contrary tend to be religious, though.
I mean... you can argue with me that a living human being isn't a living human being, or you can argue with some of your fellow liberals that easy universal access to the most effective firearms doesn't result in frequent mass shootings (even though that's what's been happening).

And economics? Once a human finds his economic philosophy and clings to it, it seems so personally intuitive to him that everyone else is obviously living in an "ideological fantasy" about how numbers and reality work.

I'm not saying all beliefs are equal, because they aren't. But part of empathy is remembering that people have reasons for believing what they do. It's not always a blind lockstep.
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  #653  
Old 10-07-2017, 07:57 AM
C9H20 C9H20 is offline

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@Sarah, when I think militant atheist I think one that is very critical or religion and outspoken about it. I'd also argue that is the general usage of the term. I certainly did not mean to imply you go around rounding up believers and throwing them into gulags, or even just imaging doing it

Ultimately you and I would probably agree on most things though I feel our outlooks are quite different. For example I too am 99,99999% sure there is no magic of any kind but I am sad about this fact because a brief stint in a meaningless universe followed by eternal darkness is about as depressing as it gets imo. I want to want to believe but I can't, don't have it in me. So I am not very religious and would not like being faced with an overbearing theocracy. And while I can agree that religion was used to justify bad things it also inspired people to be good, also religion is another tool that can bind a bunch of people into a society. You probably don't think that matters and (if I recall your beliefs correctly) think we should be loyal to the whole species rather than any subsection. Which I would argue is a laudable thought but quite unlikely to matter any time soon. I'd also argue that tradition matters, that we have a debt to our ancestors to at least pay homage to what they fought and died for. Which I am sure you'd dismiss outright.

... So yeah, similar ideas but quite different outlooks
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  #654  
Old 10-12-2017, 05:53 AM
Kakwakas Kakwakas is offline

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A court has ruled that it's okay to discriminate against certain guests from giving invocations/prayers based on their religion or lack thereof.
"Although the court found that Barker was injured, and that the defendants did not have legislative immunity, she ruled that none of the defendants was ultimately responsible for that injury.
The judge claimed that the chaplain was powerless to allow Barker to give the invocation, due to House rules yet also dismissed Barker's claim against the House itself. The decision fails to identify who, if not the House chaplain and the House itself, could be sued for implementing a rule excluding nonbelievers from participation."
There's an impressive level of bullshit there. Yes, there was wrongdoing, no, nobody is immune, but who did it is a mystery that cannot be solved so don't bother trying!
https://ffrf.org/news/news-releases/...t-wake-up-call
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  #655  
Old 10-12-2017, 08:26 AM
Mutterscrawl Mutterscrawl is offline

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Originally Posted by Kakwakas View Post
A court has ruled that it's okay to discriminate against certain guests from giving invocations/prayers based on their religion or lack thereof.
"Although the court found that Barker was injured, and that the defendants did not have legislative immunity, she ruled that none of the defendants was ultimately responsible for that injury.
The judge claimed that the chaplain was powerless to allow Barker to give the invocation, due to House rules yet also dismissed Barker's claim against the House itself. The decision fails to identify who, if not the House chaplain and the House itself, could be sued for implementing a rule excluding nonbelievers from participation."
There's an impressive level of bullshit there. Yes, there was wrongdoing, no, nobody is immune, but who did it is a mystery that cannot be solved so don't bother trying!
https://ffrf.org/news/news-releases/...t-wake-up-call

Are you fucking shitting me?
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  #656  
Old 10-12-2017, 12:34 PM
Taintedmage Taintedmage is offline

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A non issue and a foundation drumming up controversy for the sake of it.
woo.
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  #657  
Old 10-14-2017, 10:14 AM
Kakwakas Kakwakas is offline

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A non issue and a foundation drumming up controversy for the sake of it.
woo.
If the judge had at least said who the real defendant should be, I might buy that. If not them, then who?

Edit:
A Satanist in MO has won a case about anti-abortion laws violating her freedom of religion. I love these guys.
http://www.worldreligionnews.com/rel...igious-beliefs
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  #658  
Old 10-14-2017, 10:19 AM
Nazja Nazja is offline

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Please try to avoid double posting.
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  #659  
Old 10-14-2017, 10:28 AM
Kakwakas Kakwakas is offline

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Please try to avoid double posting.
I thought it was okay if the second post included new news on the subject. My bad.
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  #660  
Old 10-14-2017, 10:33 AM
Nazja Nazja is offline

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I thought it was okay if the second post included new news on the subject. My bad.
No problemo. (As far as I know, there need to be at least 3 days between the posts regardless of the subject.)
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  #661  
Old 10-14-2017, 03:12 PM
BaronGrackle BaronGrackle is offline

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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kakwakas View Post
If the judge had at least said who the real defendant should be, I might buy that. If not them, then who?

Edit:
A Satanist in MO has won a case about anti-abortion laws violating her freedom of religion. I love these guys.
http://www.worldreligionnews.com/rel...igious-beliefs
Well, good news for the Aztecs.
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  #662  
Old 10-15-2017, 08:40 PM
Taintedmage Taintedmage is offline

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So, me rambling thoughts and everything right now.
I've come to see political ideology as a far greater threat than religion.
While religion fancies itself with silly fantasies one thing I've come to realize is that it's often less dangerous due to the concept of "personal salvation." Personal salvation allows for an individual to exist within a society of other people while simultaneously gaining "utopia". On the otherhand, a political ideology which has the main aim of establishing a utopia on earth can only arrive at "salvation" through either creating or taking control of society. Thus political ideologies require more than the individual and involve social control not personal discipline, a highly bloody existence.

While it is in the realm of possibility for society to develop competing philosophies on what is "the good life" and for these to compete for individual attention and "salvation" it does not seem to have a strong enough pull.
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