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Old 09-06-2017, 07:38 PM
Lon-ami Lon-ami is offline

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Originally Posted by BaronGrackle View Post
Okay, but what happens when the world unites to tear Nazi Germany apart? That feels like a setback.
It's the same story we see now with Germany menacing the Visegrad group for being against the mandatory refugee quotas. The many join against the one, for trying to follow their own ways.

Say what you want, and don't put any bullshit tags on me, but life on Germany was very good the years before WW2, while the winners, UK and France, were still eating shit. Stuff like roads, families having cars, etc. And to top it off, coming from a wasteland of a country, the losers of WW1. We could discuss why WW2 actually happened, and the capitalism-communism-fascism war of ideas, but that wouldn't lead anywhere really.

The point is that, until the war came, fascism worked. Germany turned into a world power in a few years. And even then, with the whole world against them, they still put up a fight.

The price, however. I'd like to believe we can become prosperous without needing to kill dissidents, burn books, etc. I value my freedom a lot, but if things keep getting worse and worse, people will trade it for safety. After all, it's just another luxury. I don't want to live in a world like that.

Originally Posted by BaronGrackle View Post
Didn't he set things up for Juan Carlos to be an authoritarian monarch, but then he died and the people changed things to constitutional monarchy instead? Seems significant that these changes didn't happen until Franco died.
Well, most of that isn't public information, but I think it's easy to assume he wanted a transition, for many things out there. The country was somewhat clean of inner menaces already (well, not quite, but enough for a fresh start [didn't last long, but that's another story]), so there was no need for more dictatorship. Most of the original supporters supported him to solve a problem, and it was fixed. He wasn't needed anymore.

As for those changes, the last years were static. Had he wanted to perpetuate the regime, he would have pushed them himself, but he waited for the next guy to do them instead. I think he was an asshole, like most dictators out there, but he loved his country. I view these kind of dictators as some sort of semi-abusive fathers, but once the son grows up they just let him go.

The USA had a part on it, too, just like with Japan. Keeping the dictatorship up was a selfish interest to avoid communists taking over, but still, props to them. Had we been "democratized" by force, things would have gone way worse.

It's amazing how the model that worked so well post-WW2, is nowadays ignored when dealing with countries under dictatorships. It's almost as if they don't want things to go well.

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