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Old 08-27-2017, 02:40 PM
spidey1980 spidey1980 is offline

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Originally Posted by PajamaSalad View Post
The rules were never implemented so we can only speculate how effective or optimal it would be.
I'm gonna go out on a limb and say that, in the long term, building safe and robust is better than building fast and cheap.
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Old 08-27-2017, 02:43 PM
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Originally Posted by spidey1980 View Post
I'm gonna go out on a limb and say that, in the long term, building safe and robust is better than building fast and cheap.
Why do you think the dichotomy is between safe/robust and fast/cheap?
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Old 08-27-2017, 04:05 PM
spidey1980 spidey1980 is offline

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Originally Posted by PajamaSalad View Post
Why do you think the dichotomy is between safe/robust and fast/cheap?
If you don't understand the difference, then i really cannot help you.
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Old 08-27-2017, 04:05 PM
Mertico Mertico is offline

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Originally Posted by Mutterscrawl View Post
Because it's a lot of copy/pasting that I don't wanna do.


Okay.
Don't use it as a source then.
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Old 08-27-2017, 04:09 PM
PajamaSalad PajamaSalad is offline

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Originally Posted by spidey1980 View Post
If you don't understand the difference, then i really cannot help you.
Do you not know what dichotomy means? You presented a false dilemma. Taking longer and spending more doesn't always lead to better results especially in the case of the government.
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Old 08-27-2017, 04:51 PM
Kakwakas Kakwakas is offline

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Originally Posted by Mertico View Post
Don't use it as a source then.
Here you go:

Man yells, “Make America Great Again!” Before shooting 6 people dead.
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/arti...Kalamazoo.html

Man wearing, “Make America Great Again” hat murders 2 strangers for no reason.
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/arti...om-couple.html

A Trump supporter murders 2 police officers because they told him he couldn’t wave a Confederate flag at a high school football game.
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/arti...supporter.html

Two men beat a homeless man with a metal bar and urinate on him screaming, “Donald Trump was right, all these illegals need to be deported,” When asked for a comment about the

incident Trump defends them saying, “My supporters are very passionate. They love this country and they want this country to be great again.”
https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/...-hispanic-man/

Trump supporter attacks a Hispanic man and a Muslim student at a gas station while yelling, “Trump! Trump! Trump!”
https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/...=.fd5dc758f299

Trump supporter stabs a black man unprovoked because he was holding hands with a white woman, tells police they need to release him so he can attend a Trump rally that night.
http://www.skyvalleychronicle.com/BR...-Crime-2584308

Trump supporter attacks Muslim woman at airport.
https://www.usatoday.com/story/news/...-now/97145286/

A Trump supporter punches a 70 year old protester in the face.
http://nymag.com/daily/intelligencer...ump-rally.html

Trump supporter arrested for brutally beating protester.
http://gawker.com/trump-supporter-ch...rot-1766090832

3 Trump supporters arrested planning terrorist attack to kill Muslims.
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/entry/...b0162c043c1e90

Trump supporter confuses an Indian man for a Muslim at restaurant and says, “Things are different now, I don’t want you sand n*ggers sitting next to me.” Before attacking the man.
http://www.rawstory.com/2016/11/drun...k-for-sand-nr/

“We got a new President you fucking f*ggots.” Men yell as they attack gay man.
http://www.independent.co.uk/news/wo...-a7411116.html

Trump supporters track down and brutally beat an artist because she made a painting of Trump with a small .
http://www.nbclosangeles.com/news/lo...bcnews_twitter

Trump supporter who sucker punched protester: “Next time, we might have to kill them.”
http://www.insideedition.com/headlin...ve-to-kill-him

Trump is asked to comment on his supporters brutally beating a black man, he responds with, “Maybe he should have been roughed up,”
https://thinkprogress.org/donald-tru...-32639e4da487/

“You fucking gorillas and baby monkeys, We voted for Trump. Trump’s building a wall, beaners, and you’ll be going back to where you belong.” Man yells at black elementary school children unprovoked before he swerves his car at them attempting to hit them.
https://patch.com/new-york/bed-stuy/...ey-dont-matter

Trump supporters beat black man so badly he’s hospitalized for concussion and call him the n-word.
http://www.thedailybeast.com/black-p...for-hate-crime

Trump supporter pepper sprays a 15-year-old girl point-blank in the face after another Trump supporter groped her breasts, shouting “n*gger lover” as she attempted to run away.
https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/...e-wisc-rally/?

utm_term=.cea4ce2d8c44

Trump supporter walks up to a black man in the middle of a downtown area and says, “Donald Trump will deport you.” Before punching the black man.
http://bangordailynews.com/2016/11/2...as-hate-crime/

“Trump is going to win and if you don’t like it I’m going to beat your ass,” Trump supporter yells at random black woman outside of convenient store.
http://talkingpointsmemo.com/livewir...ampaign=buffer

In 8 months Trump supporters attacked protesters at 20 different rallies.
http://www.slate.com/blogs/the_slate...nd_events.html

Trump supporter tracks down a local Latino Democratic political candidate and tries to run him and his elderly mother over with a car. (The Latino candidate is also a former marine.)
https://www.mediaite.com/online/trum...etired-marine/

“This is for Donald Trump!” man yells as he runs up a Latino person and punches them in the head.
http://www.rawstory.com/2016/11/this...k-of-the-head/

Trump supporter goes to Hillary Clinton rally to disrupt the event, ends up punching someone when asked to leave.
http://www.nydailynews.com/news/poli...icle-1.2842182

Trump supporter punches, chokes and slaps protesters on video during rally.
http://www.businessinsider.com/man-p...p-rally-2016-9

An angry mob of Trump supporters brutally beat and grab a mans genitals because he held up a, “Republicans Against Trump” sign.
http://globalnews.ca/news/3049756/ma...st-trump-sign/

A Trump supporter yells, “Get your black kids out of here. Do you even have a job? Do you know what a job is, n*gger?” Before physically attacking a black man who had come to

the hospital to get help for his sick 2 week old daughter.
https://thinkprogress.org/black-fami...a5/#.teurfz7ja

Local Republican Politician sexually assaults a woman by, “grabbing her pussy.” and then says he is allowed to do it because now that Trump is president he doesn’t have to be politically correct.
http://www.independent.co.uk/news/ch...-a7530856.html

Canadian man who was a vocal Trump supporter both online and in person goes into a mosque and murders 6 people.
https://theintercept.com/2017/01/30/...e-nationalist/

Trump supporter physically assaults Comedian on stage for making Anti-Trump Joke.

Man yells, “Trump” while beating African immigrant cab driver.
http://fox17online.com/2016/11/17/po...-intimidation/

A Trump supporter is arrested for burning a Mosque down.
http://www.nydailynews.com/news/nati...icle-1.2792764

A Trump supporter sees a car has pro-gay bumper stickers on it and then follows the car, waiting for the 75 year old driver to get out before brutally attacking him while

screaming, “My new president says we can kill all you f*ggots now.”
http://www.abcactionnews.com/news/sa...-for-being-gay

A Trump supporter is arrested after brutally attacking gay men outside a McDonald’s. Witnesses describe the aftermath as, “There was blood everywhere.”
http://www.rawstory.com/2016/11/ther...ney-mcdonalds/

A Muslim refugee gay rights activist is kidnapped and raped by two men in retaliation for, “Trump being mocked.”
http://www.independent.co.uk/news/wo...-a7627001.html

A Trump supporter is arrested on terrorism charges for building bombs he was going to use to kill Muslims.
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/entry/...b0b958f6573d35

Person spray-paints a transgender veterans car with the word “Trump” then sets it on fire.
http://www.dailywire.com/news/10612/...amp#exit-modal

A Trump supporter attacks two Muslim women and tries to push over a stroller with a baby in it while screaming, “Get the fuck out of America”
http://www.rawstory.com/2016/09/get-...aby-strollers/

A Trump supporter tells a random Muslim woman he sees on the street, “I’m voting for Trump because he said he would send all of you terrorists out of this country.” Before attacking her.
http://dcist.com/2016/05/police_are_..._a_suspect.php

Man shoots out the windows of two businesses from a car while shouting, “Hail Trump.”
https://itsgoingdown.org/olympia-wa-...ls-hail-trump/
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Old 08-27-2017, 05:37 PM
Mutterscrawl Mutterscrawl is offline

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https://www.gq.com/story/san-francisco-is-burning

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A series of strange and unsettling fires in the Mission District have people wondering: Are the city’s landlords using arson to drive out low-income tenants? And is this the deadly endgame of gentrification and tech-boom greed? Jon Ronson investigates the mystery.
Gentrification run wild at the expense of the the poor, this is worrying


EDIT:

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Originally Posted by PajamaSalad View Post
People are trying to avoid talking about the hurricane response for some reason just like you are right here.
No one is avoiding talking about it, you haven't even answered my question.

What's Trump actually done? As far as I know response has been handled locally.
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Old 08-27-2017, 08:13 PM
Kakwakas Kakwakas is offline

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Looks like the right-wing terrorists at Charlottesville may have planned out their attack.

"Well before a white nationalist “Unite the Right” demonstration turned deadly in Charlottesville this month, attendees were planning for violence, according to leaked online chats. In private chat channels, they shared advice on weaponry and tactics, including repeatedly broaching the idea of driving vehicles through opposition crowds. After the vehicular attack which killed counterprotestor Heather Heyer, users of the channel celebrated the event."
http://fortune.com/2017/08/26/charlo...-leaked-chats/
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Old 08-28-2017, 03:34 AM
spidey1980 spidey1980 is offline

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Taking longer and spending more doesn't always lead to better results especially in the case of the government.
I'm going to try and make this very simple for you.
Which bridge would you trust more to hold up in a hurricane? The one that took longer to build due to having to fit special regulations or the one that had every corner of it cut?
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Old 08-28-2017, 04:08 AM
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Originally Posted by Kakwakas View Post
Here you go:
Shoulda said "Somethings are inherent. I'll leave it at that.", and then proceeded to link the articles about the violent Trump supporters, which is a clearly inherent trait of theirs.

Am I doing snarky partisanship right?
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Old 08-28-2017, 04:20 AM
Kakwakas Kakwakas is offline

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Seven cybersecurity members resign from Trump's advisory panel citing "insufficient attention to the growing threats."
http://fortune.com/2017/08/26/trump-...visors-resign/
I'm sure we're in good hands with Russia figuring out our cybersecurity issues for us, though, right?
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Old 08-28-2017, 04:31 AM
PajamaSalad PajamaSalad is offline

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Originally Posted by spidey1980 View Post
I'm going to try and make this very simple for you.
Which bridge would you trust more to hold up in a hurricane? The one that took longer to build due to having to fit special regulations or the one that had every corner of it cut?
You are still presenting a false dilemma. It is entirely possible to make something more efficient without sacrificing quality. It is one of the major ways we advance as a society. In this specific instance you need to suggest more than taking the statement at face value. How did these regulations help compare to the alternative and how are the new regulations cutting corners?
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Old 08-28-2017, 04:52 AM
spidey1980 spidey1980 is offline

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Originally Posted by PajamaSalad View Post
You are still presenting a false dilemma. It is entirely possible to make something more efficient without sacrificing quality.
You're reading something into Trump's EO that isn't there. He doesn't demand efficiency. He demands low cost and as little time to build as possible.
In a capitalist world that's asking for cutting corners wherever you can.

Quote:
It is one of the major ways we advance as a society. In this specific instance you need to suggest more than taking the statement at face value. How did these regulations help compare to the alternative and how are the new regulations cutting corners?
What new regulations?? He didn't propose any.

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Originally Posted by Kakwakas View Post
Looks like the right-wing terrorists at Charlottesville may have planned out their attack.

"Well before a white nationalist “Unite the Right” demonstration turned deadly in Charlottesville this month, attendees were planning for violence, according to leaked online chats. In private chat channels, they shared advice on weaponry and tactics, including repeatedly broaching the idea of driving vehicles through opposition crowds. After the vehicular attack which killed counterprotestor Heather Heyer, users of the channel celebrated the event."
http://fortune.com/2017/08/26/charlo...-leaked-chats/
Not surprising. Planning and preparing for a violent uprising inside of their safe spaces is what they've been doing ever since the internet became a thing.
It's the same in Germany too.
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Old 08-28-2017, 06:29 AM
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Originally Posted by Kakwakas View Post
Seven cybersecurity members resign from Trump's advisory panel citing "insufficient attention to the growing threats."
http://fortune.com/2017/08/26/trump-...visors-resign/
I'm sure we're in good hands with Russia figuring out our cybersecurity issues for us, though, right?
Oh this is incredibly bad, Trump's not just gutting his own presidency, he's practically sabotaging us for the future.
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Old 08-28-2017, 07:10 AM
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Originally Posted by Kakwakas View Post
Seven cybersecurity members resign from Trump's advisory panel citing "insufficient attention to the growing threats."
http://fortune.com/2017/08/26/trump-...visors-resign/
I'm sure we're in good hands with Russia figuring out our cybersecurity issues for us, though, right?
It's some difficult calculus you have to do if you're associated with any administration, especially when in the case of CEOs and members of such councils, when you've got a job outside said council.

If they do a bunch of things with which you disagree, do you stick around, and hope that you can bring the administration around to seeing why [your position] is important, so that you can have a positive influence? Or do you look to your shareholders and friends and say that the differences in politics are irreconcilable, and that you don't think your influence will make a difference?

In this case, I suspect I'd have rather they stuck around regardless of their differences, because this inspires about as much confidence in the US's defensive capabilities than would the announcement from a bunch of senior military advisers that they were resigning because the White House wasn't paying attention to ongoing threats.
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Old 08-28-2017, 08:32 AM
PajamaSalad PajamaSalad is offline

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It does sound like they were Obama appointees though. Maybe the swamp is draining itself?
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Old 08-28-2017, 09:32 AM
Kakwakas Kakwakas is offline

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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kellick View Post
It's some difficult calculus you have to do if you're associated with any administration, especially when in the case of CEOs and members of such councils, when you've got a job outside said council.

If they do a bunch of things with which you disagree, do you stick around, and hope that you can bring the administration around to seeing why [your position] is important, so that you can have a positive influence? Or do you look to your shareholders and friends and say that the differences in politics are irreconcilable, and that you don't think your influence will make a difference?

In this case, I suspect I'd have rather they stuck around regardless of their differences, because this inspires about as much confidence in the US's defensive capabilities than would the announcement from a bunch of senior military advisers that they were resigning because the White House wasn't paying attention to ongoing threats.
They would have just been thrown under the bus whenever the next inevitable cyber attack hits us, though, and it would be blamed on Obama.
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Old 08-28-2017, 10:32 AM
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Originally Posted by spidey1980 View Post
I'm going to try and make this very simple for you.
Which bridge would you trust more to hold up in a hurricane? The one that took longer to build due to having to fit special regulations or the one that had every corner of it cut?

Thats not how government jobs work.

First off, there are rules in place that dont currently need to be there, some enforced by union made laws.

Government jobs require much higher pay than is normal on other jobs for the individual.

If you have a guy who does both welding and construction, you cant have him doing both. He has to be there as one or the other, and you have to bring in other people to cover the other roles. It means crosstraining a is useless.

Removing both of those rules would increase speed and reduce cost without sacrificing quality.
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Old 08-28-2017, 12:02 PM
Kakwakas Kakwakas is offline

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Someone on Faux News actually said something that made sense!
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Old 08-28-2017, 12:02 PM
spidey1980 spidey1980 is offline

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Removing both of those rules would increase speed and reduce cost without sacrificing quality.
It would also require that one guy to put in double the work while getting paid less. Great job, you just created more poverty as well as more unemployement because instead of two jobs to give there's only one, meaning either the construction worker or the welder get nothing.
And how much effort, you think, is the one guy gonna put in his work for a shitty wage?

In the low wage sector there's a mantra: "You pretend to pay me, and i pretend to work."
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Old 08-28-2017, 12:31 PM
Kakwakas Kakwakas is offline

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"“Our boy can become president of the USA and we can engineer it,” Mr. Sater wrote in an email. “I will get all of Putins team to buy in on this, I will manage this process.”"
https://www.nytimes.com/2017/08/28/u...?smid=tw-share
Sooooo, are they still running with the "there's nothing wrong with colluding with a foreign government to influence the election" angle?
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Old 08-28-2017, 12:40 PM
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Originally Posted by Kakwakas View Post
Someone on Faux News actually said something that made sense!
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dgQCWUm81gI
It's amazing that after all this time you continue to find new ways to make me sick.
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Old 08-28-2017, 12:44 PM
Kakwakas Kakwakas is offline

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It's amazing that after all this time you continue to find new ways to make me sick.
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Old 08-28-2017, 02:00 PM
Ruinshin Ruinshin is offline

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Originally Posted by Kakwakas View Post
How hes using whataboutism is ignoring historical context of pardons in order to add weight to Trumps pardon and how its bad

He isnt saying "It doesnt matter what everyone else did, Trump did this!"

Its excusing everybody else and condeming Trump, when Trump hasnt done anything particularly newsworthy or unusual.
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Old 08-28-2017, 02:04 PM
PajamaSalad PajamaSalad is offline

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Originally Posted by spidey1980 View Post
It would also require that one guy to put in double the work while getting paid less. Great job, you just created more poverty as well as more unemployement because instead of two jobs to give there's only one, meaning either the construction worker or the welder get nothing.
And how much effort, you think, is the one guy gonna put in his work for a shitty wage?

In the low wage sector there's a mantra: "You pretend to pay me, and i pretend to work."
A job is a means to create some kind of value for society. The government is in the business of paying people to dig holes and fill them back up because it helps their election progress but it doesn't move society forward. The only way to alleviate poverty is to become more productive and then wages will rise and the price of goods will fall.
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