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  #26  
Old 05-19-2016, 09:57 AM
Commander Rotal Commander Rotal is offline

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Originally Posted by spidey1980 View Post
We'd be getting awfully close to regular temporal shenanigans there and, personally, I don't want to see an entire show sentered around time travel. STO is already annoying enough with all that Temporal Cold War stuff.
Remember how forgetting about basic 24th century technology was a regular thing to increase tension because actually using Transporters and Shuttlecraft would result in five minute episodes? Just because they have temporal tech doesn't mean the show needs to use it. In fact it doesn't even mean it has to be a Time Fleet ship. Or a ship at all. I would expect timetravel being heavily restricted in that time period, and mostly used to FIX the timeline instead of jumping around. The DTI has a nice saying in the books, paraphrased: "If you have to resort to time travel to fix a problem you've already fucked up.". Fruity language added by me.
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  #27  
Old 05-19-2016, 10:07 AM
miffy23 miffy23 is offline

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Originally Posted by spidey1980 View Post
We'd be getting awfully close to regular temporal shenanigans there and, personally, I don't want to see an entire show sentered around time travel. STO is already annoying enough with all that Temporal Cold War stuff.
Why would it involve time travel just because it's set a century later?
The last I heard about another Trek show, 'round the time Enterprise was running, it was going to be about Starfleet Intelligence in the future.
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  #28  
Old 05-19-2016, 10:49 AM
spidey1980 spidey1980 is offline

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Why would it involve time travel just because it's set a century later?
Because as you venture more and more into the future of Trek's timeline, time travel and exploration of the timestream becomes more and more frequent and eventually routine, culminating in the signing of the Temporal Accord in 2769.
It's not something I'm keen on seeing because time travel gives me headaches.
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  #29  
Old 05-21-2016, 10:06 PM
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Does it matter what time they set it in? They're all going to time-travel to 20th century Earth anyway.

Also, expect grizzled old veterans of TNG/DS9 to make guest appearances.

I expect this series to suck hard. Star Trek used to tackle social issues relatively intelligently. But these days? They'll go full SJW retard.
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  #30  
Old 05-22-2016, 02:48 AM
Hammerbrew Hammerbrew is offline

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I expect this series to suck hard. Star Trek used to tackle social issues relatively intelligently. But these days? They'll go full SJW retard.
Pretty much.
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  #31  
Old 05-22-2016, 02:50 AM
Commander Rotal Commander Rotal is offline

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Does it matter what time they set it in? They're all going to time-travel to 20th century Earth anyway.
It does to me. Unless they canonize the comics (which would get messy real fast but would confirm the Prime Timeline's survival) there is a big chance we won't ever see new canonical Post-Temporal Incursion (or, for that matter, Nemesis-era) 24th century in my lifetime. I kinda have a problem with that.

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Also, expect grizzled old veterans of TNG/DS9 to make guest appearances.
I just want Sisko to beat somebody up. We're seemingly solving every episode with fists and weapons now, might as well do it right.

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They'll go full SJW retard.
Ouch.
Y'know, i do believe Bryan Fuller has good intentions but if Hannibal (which i love in Season 1 and 2; 3 got too artsy for my taste and i hated the timeskip) is any indication every damn character is going to turn bi at some point during the series.
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  #32  
Old 05-22-2016, 05:24 PM
Commander Rotal Commander Rotal is offline

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In other news: the new Beyond trailer looks fantastic. Not perfect, some stuff still ecking me off but eh. We'll see in the theater.
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  #33  
Old 05-23-2016, 08:37 AM
CoDimus the Staunch CoDimus the Staunch is offline

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Honestly speaking, I can say that the TV revival hypes me much more than Beyond ever could. Regardless of that All Access stunt they're trying to pull.
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  #34  
Old 05-23-2016, 08:41 AM
miffy23 miffy23 is offline

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In other news: the new Beyond trailer looks fantastic. Not perfect, some stuff still ecking me off but eh. We'll see in the theater.
No. Just no. It looks absolutely horrible.
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  #35  
Old 05-23-2016, 10:12 AM
Commander Rotal Commander Rotal is offline

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No. Just no. It looks absolutely horrible.
Well, as far as looks go i'm pretty miffed about Yorktown Station (did everyone just forget what Starfleet's starbases look like?) and even with the new pylons the JJ-Prise is never going to endear itself to me but at least it looks like a step up. (incidentally: are you basing this on the first trailer (the REALLY dumb one) or the new one?) Into Dorkness was already better than 11 but that's like saying stepping into poo is better than falling face-first into it.
My main beef with it (besides the inexcuseable sin of not correcting the timeline, which is going to continue to haunt my judgement of every further movie / show that doesn't do it) is that it looks like the Franklin's going to get more character development than the Hot Dog-Prise ever did. They REALLY failed to treat the ship like a character and as such nobody's going to give a hoot about it's demise. Now that they have new writers they might be rectifying it with the Franklin. (jury's still out if that's supposed to be a JJ-verse NX-Class; it's way too small for that but when has correct scaling ever stopped them from bad decisions?)

That or they're just ripping off The Search For Spock. JJ is still producing so he's got influence.
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  #36  
Old 06-24-2016, 10:39 AM
Commander Rotal Commander Rotal is offline

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SO. "Gender-neutral lense".

Alright. First things first - 1.) the heart is in the right place and 2.) we don't know yet what that's going to mean (roles being cast gender-neutral going to the best actor, transsexual actor etc, we don't know yet; if the character is going to be involved with another one by default they might end up gay or bi, too). Shit's fine for now. Don't fucking panic.

But.

And tis' a big but.

Fuller's work worries me. And i am worried about continuity.

Here's the thing: unless you throw the Starfleet-theme out the window there's little to nothing to tell a story with gay or transsexual characters in Star Trek. Being gay isn't supposed to be a social stigma in the 23rd and 24th century (and i certainly hope we're seeing the 25th anyway, screw prequels. Btw, Fuller jossed the one rumor about the show taking place after Undiscovered Country, but realistically that could mean just about everything). People are gay or bi. Whoopdifuckingdo, Starfleet isn't going to give a shit. Great for representation, but you can't tell a special story with it, at which point the entire thing runs the risk of looking like you put a gay in for the sake of putting a gay in.
Well, okay, at least you can tell a standard falling-in-love-story with a gay couple. That's fine, right? Right.

The bigger problem would be a transsexual character.
We're already finding biological markers for transsexuality; brainwave patterns that fit the preferred gender, DNA irregularities, hormonal imbalances if i understand correctly... my optimistic guess is that we can probably scan for transgenderism in a couple decades. Add to that the awesome healthcare in that society, and what it can do; by the time of TOS you're likely given the choice of several alternatives, ranging from "curing" your brain to a genetic sex change instead of the clunky hormonal one we have to use, and from what we've seen of the Federation's medical science in regards to surgery changing your sex visually for a testrun is probably a busy afternoon for the ship's CMO at worst.
Sure. Today, in RL modern times, it can still take decades until you realize something's wrong with you, and potentially even longer until you know WHAT is wrong with you (and in the wrong country the only available treatment might kill ya from a heavy dose of stoning). But in Star Trek? With all those nifty non-issues, all that medical science, psychiatrists on the fucking bridge and available to absofuckinglutely everyone... how the hell's is transsexual going to enter Starfleet without being diagnosed and offered help before they even set foot into the academy? Transsexuality is a non-issue in Star Trek. You cannot tell a relatable story unless you break continuity and MAKE it an issue. I am HIGHLY fucking worried that they're going to put in a transgendered character just for the sake of having a transgendered character, and i DON'T fucking want that kind of representation, thank you very fucking much. Best case scenario: one character is trans, and it's never used as a plot point. Worst case scenario half the cast pulls a Hannibal and turns bisexual because it's the hip thing to do this summer.
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  #37  
Old 06-24-2016, 10:59 AM
ARM3481 ARM3481 is online now

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Originally Posted by Commander Rotal View Post
The bigger problem would be a transsexual character.
We're already finding biological markers for transsexuality; brainwave patterns that fit the preferred gender, DNA irregularities, hormonal imbalances if i understand correctly... my optimistic guess is that we can probably scan for transgenderism in a couple decades. Add to that the awesome healthcare in that society, and what it can do; by the time of TOS you're likely given the choice of several alternatives, ranging from "curing" your brain to a genetic sex change instead of the clunky hormonal one we have to use, and from what we've seen of the Federation's medical science in regards to surgery changing your sex visually for a testrun is probably a busy afternoon for the ship's CMO at worst.
Sure. Today, in RL modern times, it can still take decades until you realize something's wrong with you, and potentially even longer until you know WHAT is wrong with you (and in the wrong country the only available treatment might kill ya from a heavy dose of stoning). But in Star Trek? With all those nifty non-issues, all that medical science, psychiatrists on the fucking bridge and available to absofuckinglutely everyone... how the hell's is transsexual going to enter Starfleet without being diagnosed and offered help before they even set foot into the academy? Transsexuality is a non-issue in Star Trek. You cannot tell a relatable story unless you break continuity and MAKE it an issue. I am HIGHLY fucking worried that they're going to put in a transgendered character just for the sake of having a transgendered character, and i DON'T fucking want that kind of representation, thank you very fucking much. Best case scenario: one character is trans, and it's never used as a plot point. Worst case scenario half the cast pulls a Hannibal and turns bisexual because it's the hip thing to do this summer.
One supposes a point could theoretically be explored of such "curing" perhaps being illegal in Starfleet as part of Earth's (and subsequently the Federation's) ban on genetic modification since the Eugenics Wars, and therefore unavailable to anyone who might desire it.

Bashir's backstory in DS9 and the mental issues of the other modified humans arguably delved into the idea that for all its leaps and bounds in tolerance, even 24th century humanity still isn't entirely above cordoning off and trying to ignore people with psychological difficulties that the Federation's own laws prohibit from being fixed.

It was one of the darker parts of DS9's take on the Federation's less savory side that humanity is apparently still so terrified of another Khan coming along that part of the punishment for violating the genetic modification ban basically extends even to children who were modified before birth or in infancy, and therefore never even had any choice in the mater.

Last edited by ARM3481; 06-24-2016 at 11:10 AM..
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  #38  
Old 06-24-2016, 11:14 AM
Commander Rotal Commander Rotal is offline

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Originally Posted by ARM3481 View Post
One supposes a point could theoretically be explored of such "curing" perhaps being illegal in Starfleet as part of Earth's (and subsequently the Federation's) ban on genetic modification since the Eugenics Wars, and therefore unavailable to anyone who might desire it.

Bashir's backstory in DS9 and the mental issues of the other modified humans arguably delved into the idea that for all its leaps and bounds in tolerance, even 24th century humanity still isn't entirely above cordoning off and trying to ignore people with psychological difficulties that the Federation's own laws prohibit from being fixed.

Honestly it was one of the darker parts of DS9's darker take on the Federation's less savory side that humanity is apparently still so terrified of another Khan coming along that punishment for violating the genetic modification ban basically extends even to modified children who never even had any choice in the mater.
A couple things. Yes, the ban on genetic enhancement is a bit of a continuity-oopsie and, in my book at least, one of the few times where DS9's darker themes just didn't work for me. It's simply too far removed from previous established canon. In the Federation's defence, however, it has to be said that they don't ban genetic healing. The problem wasn't that they chose to augment Julian but that they turned him into a super-human and then kept it a secret. Julian himself also only faced consequences because he willingly and knowingly lied about it when entering the Academy, and it was only his father who got punished (relatively lightly too, if i remember correctly, but it's admittedly been a while). So while i really don't like the way the Federation treats it, that particular episode is often times misrepresented.

Personally i really have enough of darkness. We've had dark Enterprise, we had dark Nemesis, we had dark 11 and we had dark Into Darkness. Can we just fucking please get a regular Star Trek show on the air please, without the damn edgelord-drama going on?
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