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Old 01-01-2018, 09:39 PM
Krainz Krainz is offline

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Human Icon (War3) Discussion: is Odyn going to become a wasted character?

Odyn's addition to the Warcraft lore was very impactful, given that the other Keepers were depressed, which would explain their absence from world-threatening events. Also, his absence was explained by Helya locking him up in Skyhold.

Odyn is a very powerful fella, and a good amount of people expected him and his Valarjar to show up in the final push against the Legion in Argus. He was probably defending Azeroth from the thousands of ships that were still going there, however.

The next developments of the lore were revealed to be a new faction war. It was also revealed that we are going to fight Queen Azshara in the next expansion, and that we're going to explore a titan facility where the Titans were experimenting with Old Gods and their magics.

So it's pretty much confirmed (as if anyone doubted that) that world-ending threats may return within the next expansion cycle, probably laying the ground for the expansion after BFA.

Does anyone else have this kind of weird feeling that Odyn is just going to be thrown to the trash can, just like Wrathion? A big, powerful character, who could now be unleashed to protect Azeroth from the armies of the Old Gods alongside his fellow Keepers?

It just feels bad that they're probably going to do that again, since in interviews it was said that the class storylines aren't going to be continued (so they can give focus to the faction war) and you can't really fit Odyn and his stormforged Valarjar anywhere in BFA.

I honestly believe we shouldn't have any more of this kind of situation -- i.e. a very powerful entity who must be saved from peril because it would be the most helpful asset to our cause, and then nobody ever remembers about the character because it a.) wouldn't fit the setting anymore or b.) it would be just too powerful and would solve problems on a whim. Malfurion is another example.

Illidan was almost an example of that in Legion, and Blizzard needed an entire expansion dedicated to him so he wouldn't be wasted. Makes me think that the "jailor" job is going to be a cookie-cutter way to deal with this kind of storytelling design problem, on Blizzard's end.

Thoughts?
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Old 01-01-2018, 09:59 PM
ARM3481 ARM3481 is offline

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Odyn, along with anything else that doesn't contribute directly to a faction war, will likely remain sidelined fore the foreseeable future. Our Class Orders haven't mattered since 7.2, so there's no reason to think they'll start to matter again any time soon.

Or ever, really. Their rush to end the Burning Legion coupled with their entire attitude presenting BfA has made it pretty evident that their faction-addled brains found the best parts of Legion distasteful and nothing they'd be interested in revisiting any time soon.
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Old 01-01-2018, 10:26 PM
Mutterscrawl Mutterscrawl is offline

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I imagine he'll be sidelined short term, but reappear later on, either in patches during BFA or after BFA for the next expac.
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Old 01-01-2018, 10:50 PM
Insane Guy of Doom Insane Guy of Doom is offline

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Blizzard has this weird habit of seemingly deciding that certain characters should never be brought up again. It started with Med'an (which, for as horrible a character he was, should at least get either an explanation as to why he's not helping with all these global threats he was set up to combat or get fully retconned) and has continued with Wrathion and Yrel.

Yrel is especially blatant, with a CM on the forums recently all but saying outright that Captain Fareeya was created to replace her.

I fear, given how they treated the order halls as a "mistake" in regards to 7.2 and have no similar system planned for BfA, that any character involved with the class orders will suffer the same "blacklist" as those above.

At best, I could see Odyn being a corrupted boss in Uldir or another future Titan raid, given how negatively he's painted in Chronicle.
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Old 01-01-2018, 11:12 PM
Asterisk Asterisk is offline

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I'm with Mutterscrawl. It won't be until a few patches into BfA or the expansion after, but as healing Azeroth becomes more important Odyn and the other Keepers would logically become important again too. For now he just isn't relevant to the faction war.

I'm more concerned about Wrathion never showing up again than I am Odyn.
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Old 01-01-2018, 11:37 PM
Krainz Krainz is offline

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A very logical step, in my opinion, would be putting Odyn as a jailor of (or within) Uldir. He could show up after the raid is cleared, in a Trial of Valor / Nighthold fashion.

I sincerely doubt Blizzard would do that, though.
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Old 01-02-2018, 01:38 AM
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I'm curious as to what effect, if any, the most recent revelations about the Pantheon and Sargeras's imprisonment would have on the Watcher Keepers such as Ra-Den. Although a number of Keepers were in a malaise of depression - a lot of influence of the Old Gods and Loken - it seems that Thorim and Hodir, at least, are out of that funk. Freya should also be more involved, particularly in maintaining the Emerald Dream.
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Old 01-02-2018, 05:42 AM
Temo Temo is offline

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Quote:
Originally Posted by Insane Guy of Doom View Post
Blizzard has this weird habit of seemingly deciding that certain characters should never be brought up again. It started with Med'an (which, for as horrible a character he was, should at least get either an explanation as to why he's not helping with all these global threats he was set up to combat or get fully retconned) and has continued with Wrathion and Yrel.

Yrel is especially blatant, with a CM on the forums recently all but saying outright that Captain Fareeya was created to replace her.

I fear, given how they treated the order halls as a "mistake" in regards to 7.2 and have no similar system planned for BfA, that any character involved with the class orders will suffer the same "blacklist" as those above.

At best, I could see Odyn being a corrupted boss in Uldir or another future Titan raid, given how negatively he's painted in Chronicle.
Dont Forget Tirion Fordring, he could have been a very powerful player after Wrath of the Lich King, with his Argent Kingdom being an inclusive utopia, instead he only resurfaces to get killed and passed the weapon to us

Wrathion is a specially annoying situation. Its been clear they want to use him, just to remove him constantly after beta tests

Its almost like certain people push their favorite characters/OCs, and instead of furthering the story with established characters, they create their own for whatever reason. I know people do it on comics because of those sweet royalty checks, but do they get anything like that in videogame franchises?

Last edited by Temo; 01-02-2018 at 05:46 AM..
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Old 01-02-2018, 07:33 AM
Cacofonix Cacofonix is offline

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Originally Posted by Temo View Post
Dont Forget Tirion Fordring, he could have been a very powerful player after Wrath of the Lich King, with his Argent Kingdom being an inclusive utopia, instead he only resurfaces to get killed and passed the weapon to us
He didn't do much after WotLK since he would have roasted Sylvanas if he actually tried to take her down with Alliance support. And we can't have the Forsakesues have proper consequences for their behavior can we?
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Old 01-02-2018, 08:02 AM
Noitora Noitora is offline

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Originally Posted by ARM3481 View Post
Odyn, along with anything else that doesn't contribute directly to a faction war, will likely remain sidelined fore the foreseeable future. Our Class Orders haven't mattered since 7.2, so there's no reason to think they'll start to matter again any time soon.

Or ever, really. Their rush to end the Burning Legion coupled with their entire attitude presenting BfA has made it pretty evident that their faction-addled brains found the best parts of Legion distasteful and nothing they'd be interested in revisiting any time soon.
So are you going to shit on every thread about how much you hate the end of this expansion and the next one?

Odyn won't do anything next expansion, the way the rest of his people weren't important after Wrath. If or when we have another Old God, Void, or whatever expansion, he'll be around.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Insane Guy of Doom View Post
Blizzard has this weird habit of seemingly deciding that certain characters should never be brought up again. It started with Med'an (which, for as horrible a character he was, should at least get either an explanation as to why he's not helping with all these global threats he was set up to combat or get fully retconned) and has continued with Wrathion and Yrel.

Yrel is especially blatant, with a CM on the forums recently all but saying outright that Captain Fareeya was created to replace her.

I fear, given how they treated the order halls as a "mistake" in regards to 7.2 and have no similar system planned for BfA, that any character involved with the class orders will suffer the same "blacklist" as those above.

At best, I could see Odyn being a corrupted boss in Uldir or another future Titan raid, given how negatively he's painted in Chronicle.
I wouldn't go that far. Some champions are more important than others. They'll just have minor appearances until Blizz decides to give them more of a story.

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Originally Posted by Temo View Post
Dont Forget Tirion Fordring, he could have been a very powerful player after Wrath of the Lich King, with his Argent Kingdom being an inclusive utopia, instead he only resurfaces to get killed and passed the weapon to us

Wrathion is a specially annoying situation. Its been clear they want to use him, just to remove him constantly after beta tests

Its almost like certain people push their favorite characters/OCs, and instead of furthering the story with established characters, they create their own for whatever reason. I know people do it on comics because of those sweet royalty checks, but do they get anything like that in videogame franchises?
Tirion had some story in Cata. They couldn't use Wrathion properly since logically he should be wanted by everyone. Sucks they can't find a use for him.

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He didn't do much after WotLK since he would have roasted Sylvanas if he actually tried to take her down with Alliance support. And we can't have the Forsakesues have proper consequences for their behavior can we?
We all know the Forsaken have bullshit writing, but Sylvanas did have a setback this expansion, and may have a larger one next time.
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All this faction bitching and people arguing with each other and it's Fojar of all people that comes in with reasonable positivity.

Last edited by Noitora; 01-02-2018 at 08:11 AM..
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Old 01-02-2018, 08:09 AM
Mutterscrawl Mutterscrawl is offline

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A very logical step, in my opinion, would be putting Odyn as a jailor of (or within) Uldir. He could show up after the raid is cleared, in a Trial of Valor / Nighthold fashion.

I sincerely doubt Blizzard would do that, though.
Eh, he'd feel a bit out of place as a Jailor, and in a troll zone rather than leading this army he spent thousands of years building.
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Old 01-02-2018, 09:51 AM
Trickster Trickster is offline

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Eh, he'd feel a bit out of place as a Jailor, and in a troll zone rather than leading this army he spent thousands of years building.
One would expect the Odyn's Vrykul to join the Alliance in a faction war expansion with the wholeSylvanas thing going on. Would actually make more sense than the Nightborne... But, just like the Alliance gets not-High Elves/not-Ethereals with the Void Elves (don't really mind the not-High Elves anyway), we can expect getting not-Vrykul with the fat Kul'Tirans instead of The Stormheim vrykul. Which would be a real slap in the face.
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Old 01-02-2018, 09:53 AM
Asterisk Asterisk is offline

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I'd rather not have vrykul budging into dwarves' titan niche.
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Old 01-02-2018, 10:31 AM
Ethenil Ethenil is offline

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If vrykul do become an allied or full race, I fully expect Odyn's story to continue.
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Old 01-02-2018, 10:33 AM
Cacofonix Cacofonix is offline

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Originally Posted by Noitora View Post
We all know the Forsaken have bullshit writing, but Sylvanas did have a setback this expansion, and may have a larger one next time.
She's Warchief and so far has done more damage to the Alliance in Battle For Azeroth than the Alliance has done to the Horde in that same expansion. And she's not going to be killed off for good and without honor.
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Old 01-02-2018, 12:59 PM
Marthen Marthen is offline

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She's Warchief and so far has done more damage to the Alliance in Battle For Azeroth than the Alliance has done to the Horde in that same expansion.
Formal fallacy detected. I repeat, formal fallacy detected.
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Old 01-02-2018, 03:52 PM
Insane Guy of Doom Insane Guy of Doom is offline

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One would expect the Odyn's Vrykul to join the Alliance in a faction war expansion with the wholeSylvanas thing going on. Would actually make more sense than the Nightborne... But, just like the Alliance gets not-High Elves/not-Ethereals with the Void Elves (don't really mind the not-High Elves anyway), we can expect getting not-Vrykul with the fat Kul'Tirans instead of The Stormheim vrykul. Which would be a real slap in the face.
I fully believe that, given the amount of foreshadowing (on par with the nightborne and highmountain tauren) that vrykul were intended to be the third alliance allied race at some point, but something went wrong and they were replaced by the dark iron dwarves, hence them being the only allied race that has nothing to do with Legion or Battle for Azeroth.
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Old 01-02-2018, 09:35 PM
Trickster Trickster is offline

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I fully believe that, given the amount of foreshadowing (on par with the nightborne and highmountain tauren) that vrykul were intended to be the third alliance allied race at some point, but something went wrong and they were replaced by the dark iron dwarves, hence them being the only allied race that has nothing to do with Legion or Battle for Azeroth.
Blizzard should come out and justify this decision if that is the case. Because it only gives the impression that the Alliance lost a long awaited race in favour of a reskin (a cool reskin but still a reskin). Vrykul would have been a good equivalent for the Zandalari.
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Old 01-03-2018, 04:37 AM
Marthen Marthen is offline

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we can expect getting not-Vrykul with the fat Kul'Tirans instead of The Stormheim vrykul. Which would be a real slap in the face.
For you. There are people who find the strongman Kul Tirans already far more interesting than anything those generic giant vikings could provide.
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Old 01-03-2018, 04:56 AM
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For you. There are people who find the strongman Kul Tirans already far more interesting than anything those generic giant vikings could provide.
I, for one, don't either. I find the strongman Kul Tirans to be something of an asspull of lore, much like with most things we have seen of Kul Tiras for Battle for Azeroth.
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Old 01-03-2018, 06:36 AM
Marthen Marthen is offline

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I, for one, don't either. I find the strongman Kul Tirans to be something of an asspull of lore, much like with most things we have seen of Kul Tiras for Battle for Azeroth.
I don't think we will find agreement here. I genuinely enjoy what we have seen so far on Kul Tiras, especially its themes. It's shaping up to by my new favorite human kingdom.
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Old 01-03-2018, 08:31 AM
Ethenil Ethenil is offline

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I personally would absolutely love to have Stormheim vrykul as an Alliance allied race, even instead of this e Tirassian people.
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Old 01-03-2018, 09:01 AM
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I don't think we will find agreement here. I genuinely enjoy what we have seen so far on Kul Tiras, especially its themes. It's shaping up to by my new favorite human kingdom.
You must be easily impressed. I loathe the variant morphology which reeks of exceptionalism.
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Old 01-03-2018, 10:23 AM
Marthen Marthen is offline

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You must be easily impressed. I loathe the variant morphology which reeks of exceptionalism.
You can tell yourself that if it comforts you, but it's hardly the truth. In the end, Warcraft is all about imaginery and basic themes, the rest being rather shallow and without any meaningful impact. So pardon me if I enjoy the imaginery and basic themes of Kul Tiras as presented more than the imaginery of other human kingdoms or the Stormheim vrykul.
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Old 01-03-2018, 10:28 AM
Patrick_C Patrick_C is offline

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Originally Posted by Insane Guy of Doom View Post
Blizzard has this weird habit of seemingly deciding that certain characters should never be brought up again. It started with Med'an (which, for as horrible a character he was, should at least get either an explanation as to why he's not helping with all these global threats he was set up to combat or get fully retconned) and has continued with Wrathion and Yrel.

Yrel is especially blatant, with a CM on the forums recently all but saying outright that Captain Fareeya was created to replace her.

I fear, given how they treated the order halls as a "mistake" in regards to 7.2 and have no similar system planned for BfA, that any character involved with the class orders will suffer the same "blacklist" as those above.

At best, I could see Odyn being a corrupted boss in Uldir or another future Titan raid, given how negatively he's painted in Chronicle.
I think he will go down the A'dal route: A cameo on a sidequest in the next xpac, and then forgotten forever.

I don't think it's a recent trend, tough. I think this had been the rule ever since the inception of WoW - threads are left open for further development, but the (next?) team decides it's too much work/not interesting enough so they either abandon it or give it a rushed and unsatisfying ending in order to go do other things.

Last edited by Patrick_C; 01-03-2018 at 10:34 AM..
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