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  #51  
Old 12-24-2013, 04:25 PM
Drusus Drusus is offline

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Originally Posted by Genesis View Post
Stromgarde has better chances of being reclaimed than Lordaeron. But there is little chance that the Arathi Highlands will be updated, though you could always try convincing Kosak that an Arathi Highlands update could tie-in with Warlords of Draenor.
Only if his undead waifu gets to conquer it.

That, or the fanon that seem to think Stromgarde soldiers are #savage Conan-wannabes.
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  #52  
Old 12-25-2013, 04:33 AM
CoDimus the Staunch CoDimus the Staunch is offline

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  #53  
Old 12-25-2013, 04:55 AM
Thunderbraid Thunderbraid is offline

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Why is it that dwarf fans seem to have such a hard-on for the human kingdom of Stromgarde?
Late reply, but because of the tactical significance of Stromgarde for the dwarves.

It sits on the trade lane between Aerie Peak and Khaz Modan, it can be used as a buffer against a hostile enemy state, which leaves Khaz Modan as one of the few kingdoms on Azeroth that does not border enemy or otherwise hostile territory, something very rare.

In short, dwarf fans tend to care about Stromgarde because it's existence helps to keep dwarves safe!

For me with Stromgarde, it's all about what it can offer the dwarves, not the other way around really. It just so happens that the dwarves offering things to Stromgarde, like aid, directly benefits Khaz Modan, so it's a win-win and there's really no excuse not to!
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  #54  
Old 12-25-2013, 08:24 PM
Lutinz Lutinz is offline

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Part of me really hopes that Calia doesn't come back at all but I think regardless how she came back people would be disappointed. The problem is that that the heart of the matter is about Lordearon and Blizzard can't realistically ever give it back to the Alliance, at least not while WoW is running.

This means that Calia's return would disappoint those who are most interested in what she represents being 'Lordearon'. If she returns as a rallying point for the Alliance and its interest in Lordearon it will almost certainly either end in failure with, at best, Sylvanas dead and the Alliance still retreating ala SoO or Calia's story will basically be about moving on from Lordearon and accepting that the nation is now dead, kind of similar to how Vol'jin makes the argument in Shadows of the Horde that the problem with the other troll tribes is that the world has moved on and they keep chasing after the past.

Either solution isn't going to end with the Alliance felling particularly victorious or satisfied. Frankly it feels more like it will just rile up the Lordearon fans and then piss them off when they fail to get the resolution that they hoped for.

If she has to come back I hope for the second one. At least that offers a resolution. The Alliance really has to move on, remembering the past but looking to the future. Calia in a way could embody that.
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  #55  
Old 12-26-2013, 12:12 AM
Erthad Erthad is offline

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Why is it that dwarf fans seem to have such a hard-on for the human kingdom of Stromgarde?
I think for me it's because I enjoy the jingoistic nature of both of them.
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  #56  
Old 12-26-2013, 12:17 AM
PajamaSalad PajamaSalad is offline

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I think for me it's because I enjoy the jingoistic nature of both of them.
Isn't Quel'thalas similar?
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  #57  
Old 12-26-2013, 12:25 AM
Lord Grimtale Lord Grimtale is offline

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Isn't Quel'thalas similar?
Isn't Gilneas similar?
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  #58  
Old 12-26-2013, 12:31 AM
PajamaSalad PajamaSalad is offline

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Isn't Gilneas similar?
Not anymore.
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  #59  
Old 12-26-2013, 12:49 AM
Lord Grimtale Lord Grimtale is offline

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Not anymore.
I ask because NPC's refer to it all the time when clicking on them, so their national pride may have been subdued but it's still there.
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  #60  
Old 12-26-2013, 12:55 AM
PajamaSalad PajamaSalad is offline

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I ask because NPC's refer to it all the time when clicking on them, so their national pride may have been subdued but it's still there.
I wouldn't know. I haven't played Alliance since Burning Crusade. You do know that I support most of what you want with the worgen though.
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  #61  
Old 12-26-2013, 04:24 AM
Yaskaleh Yaskaleh is offline

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I wouldn't know. I haven't played Alliance since Burning Crusade. You do know that I support most of what you want with the worgen though.


Sounds like the mirror of my own actions. I stopped playing Horde when TBC was released.
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  #62  
Old 12-26-2013, 04:48 AM
Hammerbrew Hammerbrew is offline

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Originally Posted by Erthad View Post
I think for me it's because I enjoy the jingoistic nature of both of them.


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Jingoism is patriotism in the form of aggressive foreign policy. Jingoism also refers to bias against free trade with foreign nations, generally by citing the myth that domestic jobs are damaged by engaging in trade. In practice, it is a country's advocation of the use of threats or actual force against peaceful relations, either economic or political, with other countries in order to safeguard what it perceives as its national interests. Colloquially, it refers to excessive bias in judging one's own country as superior to others—an extreme type of nationalism.
You'll have to explain for me how the Dwarfs, or the former Kingdom of Stromgarde, are/were 'jingoistic' because I just don't see it.

Stromgarde's lore, for one thing, isn't nearly deep enough to know for sure, but it's hinted in the novels that outside of a rivalry with Alterac over borders, they're fairly easy going people, happy to stay in their Ancestral lands.

Dwarfs, outside of the AV debate (which, canon wise, I'd argue the Frostwolves started by killing Dwarven Explorers), have never been shown to be anything BUT peaceful and decent with Humans and their Gnomeish cousins.
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  #63  
Old 12-26-2013, 05:56 AM
Drusus Drusus is offline

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Originally Posted by Lord Grimtale View Post
I ask because NPC's refer to it all the time when clicking on them, so their national pride may have been subdued but it's still there.
They used to be, but once you join the Alliance you become a Lawful Good blob of pure goodness and all the best traits of Humanity.

I understand the Gilneans would likely be grateful for Alliance assistance by this point (which pisses me off even further), but where was the proud, arrogant, Gilneas stereotype we hear so much about? They might as well be Stormwinders who can turn into werewolves. The Lord of his Pack story tried to show this a bit, with the worgen refusing to let the night elf sailors help them, but all we see in-game are the Worgen needing everybody elses help.

Then again, that we don't actually see the Worgen after their starting zone probably doesn't help either.
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  #64  
Old 12-26-2013, 05:59 AM
Thunderbraid Thunderbraid is offline

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The dwarves are the -only- race in Warcraft to outright make an imperialist move (several it could be argued, but they're not as obvious), and crucially actually acknowledge it as an imperialist action and then continue to support and celebrate it wholeheartedly. Hence the jingoistic description.
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  #65  
Old 12-26-2013, 03:56 PM
Fojar Fojar is offline

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Originally Posted by Thunderbraid View Post
The dwarves are the -only- race in Warcraft to outright make an imperialist move (several it could be argued, but they're not as obvious), and crucially actually acknowledge it as an imperialist action and then continue to support and celebrate it wholeheartedly. Hence the jingoistic description.
Orcs and Forsaken would like a word.
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You are right Fojar.
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You are right Fojar.
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  #66  
Old 12-30-2013, 12:20 PM
Menel'dirion Menel'dirion is offline

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I have a few conflicting ideas as to who Calia would be, and they're somewhat mutually exclusive. I'll put one or two of them here.

In just about all of them, she's a Cleric. In the real world holiness was a good way of avoiding arranged marriage, so joining a convent would work. While I don't necessarily think that vows of chastity and/or celibacy are required of the Azerothian Church's clergy, I'd imagine they are available to those who choose that as a measure of devotion. This was the route chosen by Calia in order to avoid the fate her father would have forced upon her. She would have become Alonsus Foals Protege, and would be taking Benedictus' spot in the Cathedral district of Stormwind.

She'd be giving trouble to the Wrynn family, possibly guilt tripping Varian for not saving Stormwind from it's fate.

Just a thought, she might be in a more or less symbiotic relationship with a Dreadlord (Varimathras, Tichondrias, or Detheroc). It would like to be possessing her, but she's strong enough of will and in the light to keep it under control and harness it's shadow magic. That doesn't mean it doesn't affect her. Possibly the faction leader of Playable Dreadlords (more information available by request).

In the event that an heir is desired, we could possibly hook her up with Varian as his second wife (she's young enough, I think), with Anduin getting a considerably younger sibling someday soon. The two would be a bit of a bickering couple.

In any case, she's a master at negotiation, diplomacy, and manipulation.

Now I'm going to write the undead version.
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