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Old 07-09-2013, 08:24 PM
Shaman Shaman is offline

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PvP Symbol - Horde What should happen to the Horde?

Garrosh is on his way out of Azeroth. The Horde is going to be at its most vulnerable soon after Warchief Hellscream is deposed and pretty much anything could happen to it. Make or break territory here. The Horde could fall apart, reform under Vol'jin or be destroyed. Imagine you're a general in the Alliance army and a council is being held to discuss what should be the fate of the Horde after the Siege of Orgrimmar. What would you recommend to King Varian? Considering what the Horde has done, its history and the kind of personalities the Horde attracts, what would be the morally right thing to do with it after its upcoming defeat?

Knowing what has happened when the Alliance has given the Horde second chances in the past, what should be done this time?
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Old 07-09-2013, 08:31 PM
Garotar Garotar is offline

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Personally I think that the Alliance should get a treaty out of the Horde that has a greater benefit to the Alliance, but also generally doesn't screw the Horde over so the same thing doesn't repeat itself again.
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Old 07-09-2013, 08:33 PM
Millenia Millenia is offline

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The Alliance should destroy all its land, resources, technology, and deities, kill off its entire population while ensuring the destruction of all the corpses. Then when the next world killing invader comes, the Horde and the neutrals will feel so bad that they treated the Alliance so shittily. That'll show 'em.

Or just have the Alliance pull a Shao Hao. Same result, ultimately. Not like the Horde will go through Heaven and Hell just to say "sorry" with the latter option.
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Because if a storyteller is doing his job, he makes you care. And if that storyteller then says "I dunno, then they stopped fighting, I guess," without any explanation or clarification, his audience has every right to be pissed off. Because they were given reason to stay interested, reason to keep up with his tale, only to be shut down just as things were getting good. A waste of time, a waste of emotional tension, a waste, if you fail to grasp the significance of narrative, of money.

Last edited by Millenia; 07-09-2013 at 08:36 PM..
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Old 07-09-2013, 08:36 PM
Garotar Garotar is offline

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If we want to talk outside gameplay constraints, then the Alliance should probably try to absorb the Horde races who wish to join that they don't overly hate.
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Old 07-09-2013, 08:38 PM
Mutterscrawl Mutterscrawl is offline

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Take back the resources they pillaged, destroy the old god /titan stuff they dug up, fortify regions on the borders of Horde territories and have lots of spies and scouts move around their lands nonviolently. If there are any signs another Garrosh is popping up, off them, make it look like an accident so as not to insight the populace.

Feel free to offer aid and trade so long as it paints the Alliance in a benevolent light to the Horde's citizens, but have them heavily escorted, DO NOT HAVE THEM LOOK LAVISH, Have them look gruff.
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Old 07-09-2013, 08:46 PM
BaronGrackle BaronGrackle is offline

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Declare Anduin the warchief of the Horde.

Declare Baine the supreme commander of the Alliance.
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Old 07-09-2013, 08:49 PM
ijffdrie ijffdrie is offline

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I would make the following demands:

-With the exception of the alterac mountains, quel'thalas and the territories claimed by the argent crusade, all territory in the subcontinent of Lordaeron is reclaimed by the alliance. Forsaken and members of the revantusk tribe are given one month to evacuate, in which ships from the horde may assist, as long as they have alliance overseers on board. Any who remain behind shall be executed.

-Orcs loyal to the horde are to leave the eastern kingdoms entirely. Any group staying in the eastern kingdoms will be considered an enemy of the alliance, and will be annihilated. This rule does not apply to the frostwolf clan, due to services rendered during the war. If they agree to allow for dwarven archaeologists, safe passage for traders and assistance in the extermination of the forsaken, the alliance will acknowledge their claim on the currently occupied regions of the alterac mountains

-Horde forces are to leave all areas in Kalimdor bar Durotar, the barrens, dustwallow marsh, mulgore, thousand needles, desolace and azshara. With the new forests in the barrens and desolace, there should be no resource shortage.

-All horde forces bar the taunka are to be removed from Northrend.

-All ogre clans are to be freed from their service to the horde.

-SI:7 will be given free access to remaining horde territory.

-The three finest bottles of wine in Quel'thalas.
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Old 07-09-2013, 08:59 PM
Shaman Shaman is offline

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Quote:
Originally Posted by ijffdrie View Post
-All horde forces bar the taunka are to be removed from Northrend.
Is that a good idea? Don't the Horde also help to protect Northrend's native races from predatory forces like the nerubians, undead and vykrul?
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Old 07-09-2013, 09:01 PM
Mutterscrawl Mutterscrawl is offline

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Quote:
Originally Posted by Sarahmoo View Post
Is that a good idea? Don't the Horde also help to protect Northrend's native races from predatory forces like the nerubians, undead and vykrul?
With the undead nerubians gone I think the live ones can be negotiated with.

They weren't onboard with the Old Gods, else they wouldn't have fought the Faceless.
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Old 07-09-2013, 09:02 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Skytotem View Post
With the undead nerubians gone I think the live ones can be negotiated with.

They weren't onboard with the Old Gods, else they wouldn't have fought the Faceless.
How do you know the undead nerubians are gone?
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Old 07-09-2013, 09:05 PM
Kellick Kellick is offline

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Turn Durotar into Azeroth's equivalent of Latvia jokes, with the difference of hot instead of cold.

One day, Orc hear knock on door. Orc asks "Who is?". "Is potato man, come to give potato." Orc open door, but is no potato man, is Alliance politburo.

Such is life.

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Originally Posted by ijffdrie View Post
Forsaken and members of the revantusk tribe are given one month to evacuate, in which ships from the horde may assist, as long as they have alliance overseers on board. Any who remain behind shall be executed.
What logic is there behind booting the Revantusk out of the Hinterlands?
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Old 07-09-2013, 09:05 PM
ijffdrie ijffdrie is offline

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Quote:
Originally Posted by Sarahmoo View Post
Is that a good idea? Don't the Horde also help to protect Northrend's native races from predatory forces like the nerubians, undead and vykrul?
Eh, those threats should be majorly diminished. With the blue dragonflight and grizzly hills furbolg sane again, and (OXFORD COMMA, W00000!) the races of frost and stone united and back in control of Ulduar, there is no real need for the token horde force to remain.

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What logic is there behind booting the Revantusk out of the Hinterlands?
Them and the wildhammer have been at war since vanilla
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Old 07-09-2013, 09:08 PM
PajamaSalad PajamaSalad is offline

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I think martial law in Orgrimmar would be cool. I have a feeling hostilities are going to end after MoP though.
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Old 07-09-2013, 09:08 PM
Noitora Noitora is offline

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No one cares about trolls so eh
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Old 07-09-2013, 09:09 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Sarahmoo View Post
How do you know the undead nerubians are gone?
We wiped them out in the 5 man quests.
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Old 07-09-2013, 09:10 PM
Shaman Shaman is offline

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Quote:
Originally Posted by ijffdrie View Post
Eh, those threats should be majorly diminished. With the blue dragonflight and grizzly hills furbolg sane again, the races of frost and stone united and back in control of Ulduar, there is no real need for the token horde force to remain.
The native races like the tuskarr, wolvar, furbolg and trolls are also "majorly diminished". Doesn't the Horde have a shared responsibility to safeguard Northrend from those that would do evil to it?
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Old 07-09-2013, 09:10 PM
Kellick Kellick is offline

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Quote:
Originally Posted by ijffdrie View Post
Them and the wildhammer have been at war since vanilla
Technically, they've been at war since the War of the Three Hammers ended with the Wildhammers invading the Hinterlands.
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Old 07-09-2013, 09:11 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Skytotem View Post
We wiped them out in the 5 man quests.
Nerubians build tunnels, and I remember those five-mans, and I don't believe we explored even half of those cave systems. To say that there are no more undead nerubians is to ignore what made them so deadly in the first place.
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Old 07-09-2013, 09:13 PM
Mutterscrawl Mutterscrawl is offline

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Originally Posted by Sarahmoo View Post
Nerubians build tunnels, and I remember those five-mans, and I don't believe we explored even half of those cave systems. To say that there are no more undead nerubians is to ignore what made them so deadly in the first place.
We put the live nerubians back in positions of power from which to handle undead nerubians which have Bolvar weighing down on em.
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Old 07-09-2013, 09:22 PM
Kellick Kellick is offline

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Quote:
Originally Posted by Sarahmoo View Post
The native races like the tuskarr, wolvar, furbolg and trolls are also "majorly diminished". Doesn't the Horde have a shared responsibility to safeguard Northrend from those that would do evil to it?
That's actually not a bad point, considering that as per the Pandaren starting zone, the purpose of the Horde is to band "against a hostile world which would see them destroyed", so it could be interesting to see that be the Horde's official direction when dealing with the minor races.

Conversely, it'd also make sense for the Alliance to highlight its own goals by trying to shape the Horde to its ideals for a "peaceful and just world" by quietly removing any who would run contrary to their aims and pulling the strings to get it going on the "right" path.
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Old 07-09-2013, 09:24 PM
ijffdrie ijffdrie is offline

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Quote:
Originally Posted by Sarahmoo View Post
The native races like the tuskarr, wolvar, furbolg and trolls are also "majorly diminished". Doesn't the Horde have a shared responsibility to safeguard Northrend from those that would do evil to it?
Honestly, I'd disagree. Neither the horde nor the alliance have any responsibility to safeguard Northrend, beyond protecting their own people. Them helping others is nice, but not a responsibility.

Plus, I think you're seriously overestimating the remaining threats. Between Wyrmrest temple, Coldarra, Ulduar, Grizzlemaw, the taunka and all the alliance bases, Northrend has plenty of armies that are still in fighting shape.

Though maybe allowing a set number of horde troops to stay to help protect the taunka would be acceptable.
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Old 07-09-2013, 09:47 PM
Menel'dirion Menel'dirion is offline

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Honestly, (and no small part of this is based in Saurfang's soundfiles), the Horde as we know it has been torn apart, torn in half. It needs to take a break from the Alliance War long enough for some introspection. It's been torn down by one bad warchief, it needs to take time to figure out what it is going to build itself back up into. Some political intrigue could help with that.
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Old 07-09-2013, 09:58 PM
Millenia Millenia is offline

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At the very least, the Horde should set free all Alliance-race prisoners they have. Because, seriously, Thrall not banning human experimentation was total fucking bullshit.

Also:

Quote:
Originally Posted by Kellick View Post
Turn Durotar into Azeroth's equivalent of Latvia jokes, with the difference of hot instead of cold.

One day, Orc hear knock on door. Orc asks "Who is?". "Is potato man, come to give potato." Orc open door, but is no potato man, is Alliance politburo.

Such is life.
One day, three orcs got together in Orgrimmar. They grunted to each other, and eventually the topic turned to how their children are doing.

"Child is soldier. Has all the honor he can get." Bragged one.

"That nothing. Child is pig rancher. Can eat pork until stomach burst." Added the other.

"Child stillborn. For him, struggle already over." Grunted the third.

The other orcs agreed that the third's child had the best situation of all. Then they were sad.
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The Alliance's three rules on faction conflict:
1) You can't win.
2) You can't break even.
3) You can't leave the game.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Mustrum View Post
Because if a storyteller is doing his job, he makes you care. And if that storyteller then says "I dunno, then they stopped fighting, I guess," without any explanation or clarification, his audience has every right to be pissed off. Because they were given reason to stay interested, reason to keep up with his tale, only to be shut down just as things were getting good. A waste of time, a waste of emotional tension, a waste, if you fail to grasp the significance of narrative, of money.
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Old 07-09-2013, 10:13 PM
EdWunclerIII EdWunclerIII is offline

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Quote:
Originally Posted by Garotar View Post
If we want to talk outside gameplay constraints, then the Alliance should probably try to absorb the Horde races who wish to join that they don't overly hate.
Which ones would those be?
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Old 07-09-2013, 10:14 PM
Noitora Noitora is offline

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Quote:
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Which ones would those be?
Tauren, pandaren, goblins if paid enough, and blood elves after a spa treatment.
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