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  #276  
Old 12-20-2013, 03:54 PM
Anansi Anansi is offline

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Forgive me, but I'm going to guess that your standards for them avoiding one of those two options would be something that would wholly ruin their potential as a playable race and give the Alliance a massive unearned territorial grab.
Forgive me, but that's a non sequitor.
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  #277  
Old 12-20-2013, 03:55 PM
Xilizhra Xilizhra is offline

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Forgive me, but that's a non sequitor.
Perhaps. In any case, I was baited, and I apologize. Back to constructive things.

I do look forward to WoD, in that it should provide a good chance for the Horde to finally defeat its inner demons in full.
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  #278  
Old 12-20-2013, 03:55 PM
Fojar Fojar is offline

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Originally Posted by Xilizhra View Post
Forgive me, but I'm going to guess that your standards for them avoiding one of those two options would be something that would wholly ruin their potential as a playable race and give the Alliance a massive unearned territorial grab.
If the Forsaken being portrayed consistently "ruins" them for you.
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  #279  
Old 12-20-2013, 03:56 PM
HlaaluStyle HlaaluStyle is offline

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Originally Posted by Xilizhra View Post
Forgive me, but I'm going to guess that your standards for them avoiding one of those two options would be something that would wholly ruin their potential as a playable race and give the Alliance a massive unearned territorial grab.
He'd only be happy with the restoration of Lordaeron.

I'd be content with the reclamation of Gilneas and the Alliance having more of a presence in Arathi and Hillsbrad.

Neither's going to happen, however.
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  #280  
Old 12-20-2013, 03:58 PM
Xilizhra Xilizhra is offline

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While I think it might be too soon, I was reading about the memorial in Turkey at Gallipoli for the Entente forces who died in the invasion, and it occurred to me that, at some point in the future, the Horde putting something like it up at Dranosh'ar Landing would be... touching, somehow.

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"Those heroes that shed their blood and lost their lives...
You are now lying in the soil of a friendly country.
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There is no difference between the Johnnies and the Mehmets to us where they lie side by side here in this country of ours...
You, the mothers, who sent their sons from far away countries wipe away your tears.
Your sons are now lying in our bosom and are at peace.
After having lost their lives on this land they have become our sons as well."
Ataturk 1934
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  #281  
Old 12-20-2013, 04:01 PM
HlaaluStyle HlaaluStyle is offline

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Originally Posted by Xilizhra View Post
While I think it might be too soon, I was reading about the memorial in Turkey at Gallipoli for the Entente forces who died in the invasion, and it occurred to me that, at some point in the future, the Horde putting something like it up at Dranosh'ar Landing would be... touching, somehow.
That would be a nice touch.
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  #282  
Old 12-20-2013, 04:12 PM
Erthad Erthad is offline

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I think the only way to fix the Forsaken, and make them able to team up with other playable races like the Humans to take on neutral evil threats without it being lolore is to completely wipe the slate clean.

It can't just be Sylvanas who dies, the sadistic and evil "death to the living" Forsaken have to go too.

The Forsaken and a Alliance need to get to a place where some tension exists, but the two groups shouldn't feel like they ought to be in all out war.

Really, I think 3 things need to happen.

1. The evil elements need to be purged from the Forsaken through both an external Alliance force, and a group of Forsaken that doesn't want war with the Alliance.

2. The Forsaken need to show sorrow for what they did and make amends, even if they suffer some because of it.

3. The Alliance needs to accept that the western Lordaeron area belongs to the Forsaken, and they need to not be antagonistic to the Forsaken.
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  #283  
Old 12-20-2013, 04:20 PM
JorgeAxe JorgeAxe is offline

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What does everyone think should be done with the Western Horde?
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  #284  
Old 12-20-2013, 04:22 PM
Lord Grimtale Lord Grimtale is offline

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Originally Posted by JorgeAxe View Post
What does everyone think should be done with the Western Horde?
Orcs should have their shamanistic themes fleshed out better and be a part of their society again, that also means the Frostwolves need more development again. (Not the AU Frostwolves, I'm talking about the MU kinds.)

Baine needs to grow a spine and actually establish where he wants the Tauren to go. Tauren need their ferocity back like they had in WC3.

Trolls... should tame more fucking dinosaurs. I want to see a Darkspear T-rex.
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  #285  
Old 12-20-2013, 04:24 PM
Genesis Genesis is offline

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Originally Posted by JorgeAxe View Post
What does everyone think should be done with the Western Horde?
At this point? Let Naralex completely change the Northern Barrens into a fertile land. (It was idiotic, in my opinion, for the updated Naralex storyline to be in the Southern Barrens and not the Northern Barrens.) Bring in shamans and druids to further grow the area of the Southfury Watershed.
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  #286  
Old 12-20-2013, 04:53 PM
Fojar Fojar is offline

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Quote:
Originally Posted by Xilizhra View Post
While I think it might be too soon, I was reading about the memorial in Turkey at Gallipoli for the Entente forces who died in the invasion, and it occurred to me that, at some point in the future, the Horde putting something like it up at Dranosh'ar Landing would be... touching, somehow.
Yeah, I would feel more insulted if the Horde put that up at this point considering they have made absolutely no effort yet to improve relations and indeed are enjoying all the benefits of Garrosh's reign as we speak.

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Originally Posted by Erthad View Post
3. The Alliance needs to accept that the western Lordaeron area belongs to the Forsaken, and they need to not be antagonistic to the Forsaken.
This would make it exactly the same as Siege of Orgrimmar. The Forsaken "lose" and then become "good guys" by writer fiat while suffering absolutely no negative consequences.

If the Forsaken are going to stay and be "good guys" then the Alliance gets to occupy all their territories and the Forsaken have to stop reproducing.
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You are right Fojar.
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  #287  
Old 12-20-2013, 04:55 PM
Xilizhra Xilizhra is offline

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Originally Posted by Fojar View Post
Yeah, I would feel more insulted if the Horde put that up at this point considering they have made absolutely no effort yet to improve relations and indeed are enjoying all the benefits of Garrosh's reign as we speak.
Varian judged their attack on Garrosh an effort to improve relations enough to end the war.
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  #288  
Old 12-20-2013, 04:55 PM
Fojar Fojar is offline

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Originally Posted by Xilizhra View Post
Varian judged their attack on Garrosh an effort to improve relations enough to end the war.
Varian is a dumbass for ending the war and not demanding concrete concessions from the Horde.
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You are right Fojar.
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You are right Fojar.
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  #289  
Old 12-20-2013, 04:57 PM
Xilizhra Xilizhra is offline

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Quote:
Originally Posted by Fojar View Post
Varian is a dumbass for ending the war and not demanding concrete concessions from the Horde.
To my knowledge, you get control of Ashenvale and Gilneas again.
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  #290  
Old 12-20-2013, 04:58 PM
Fojar Fojar is offline

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Originally Posted by Xilizhra View Post
To my knowledge, you get control of Ashenvale and Gilneas again.
The Alliance already controlled Ashenvale and Gilneas hasn't so much been regained by the Alliance as the Forsaken apparently plagued it and left.

Again, zero concessions from the Horde and you think that making a happy memorial is warranted?
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You are right Fojar.
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You are right Fojar.
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  #291  
Old 12-20-2013, 05:04 PM
Xilizhra Xilizhra is offline

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Quote:
Originally Posted by Fojar View Post
The Alliance already controlled Ashenvale and Gilneas hasn't so much been regained by the Alliance as the Forsaken apparently plagued it and left.

Again, zero concessions from the Horde and you think that making a happy memorial is warranted?
I did say it might be too soon. It's more of an eventual thing, once we can be more sure of continued peace. But at least Varian is actually working toward peace.
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  #292  
Old 12-20-2013, 05:06 PM
Fojar Fojar is offline

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Originally Posted by Xilizhra View Post
I did say it might be too soon. It's more of an eventual thing, once we can be more sure of continued peace. But at least Varian is actually working toward peace.
Surrendering to the Horde is one way to get peace, yes.
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You are right Fojar.
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You are right Fojar.
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You are right Fojar.
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You are right Fojar.
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  #293  
Old 12-20-2013, 05:13 PM
Quirnheim Quirnheim is offline

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When I play my Horde toons I dislike how...absolute things are. You either:

a) want to totally destroy your enemy down to the last living thing.

Or

b) Do nothing

It's like...wut?
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  #294  
Old 12-20-2013, 05:18 PM
Noitora Noitora is offline

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Originally Posted by JorgeAxe View Post
What does everyone think should be done with the Western Horde?
Orcs need to figure out what the fuck they want to be, and kill every orc that refuses, and to stop dragging everyone down their shit.

Tauren need to figure out what the fuck they want to be, and either kill or convince everyone else that refuses. Also stop being pushovers, and regain their shamanism.

Trolls need to figure out what the fuck they want to be, and either kill or convince everyone else that refuses. Also stop being useless and tame some fucking dinosaurs. I also want a fucking Loa Megazord. Fuck the logic. Make that shit happen.
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All this faction bitching and people arguing with each other and it's Fojar of all people that comes in with reasonable positivity.
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  #295  
Old 12-20-2013, 05:33 PM
PajamaSalad PajamaSalad is offline

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Can the Alliance just conquer the Horde and we can abolish the faction system as they assimilate them? I would be okay with that. The Horde can even be under martial law during that period.
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  #296  
Old 12-20-2013, 05:38 PM
Noitora Noitora is offline

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Can the Alliance just conquer the Horde and we can abolish the faction system as they assimilate them? I would be okay with that. The Horde can even be under martial law during that period.
No.
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  #297  
Old 12-20-2013, 05:40 PM
Mutterscrawl Mutterscrawl is online now

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Originally Posted by Lord Grimtale View Post
Orcs should have their shamanistic themes fleshed out better and be a part of their society again, that also means the Frostwolves need more development again. (Not the AU Frostwolves, I'm talking about the MU kinds.)
I would love non-frostwolf shaman and orcs who are capable of being 'not evil'.
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  #298  
Old 12-20-2013, 05:41 PM
PajamaSalad PajamaSalad is offline

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Originally Posted by Noitora View Post
No.
Wouldn't that make Fojar happy and allow the Horde to not be bad anymore? I really don't care about feeling weak if the Alliance was able to win like that.
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  #299  
Old 12-20-2013, 05:41 PM
Lord Grimtale Lord Grimtale is offline

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Originally Posted by Skytotem View Post
I would love non-frostwolf shaman and orcs who are capable of being 'not evil'.
That'd be fine, but Frostwolves kinda also strike me as underdeveloped. It's nearly the same problems with Humans and the Silver Hand imo.
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  #300  
Old 12-20-2013, 05:42 PM
Mutterscrawl Mutterscrawl is online now

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That'd be fine, but Frostwolves kinda also strike me as underdeveloped. It's nearly the same problems with Humans and the Silver Hand imo.
I just don't like the frostwolves all that much.

Part of it is their colors are lame and Blizz has never made Ice a good theme for the orcs.
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