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  #26  
Old 07-27-2013, 11:04 PM
Reignac Reignac is offline

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Originally Posted by Thunderbraid View Post
Bronzebeards can still expand and take it over.

Dark Irons should retake Shadowforge as well.
I was under the impression that they already had Shadowforge, but the capital had just moved to Ironforge with Moira.

BRD is just in its Vanilla time bubble.
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It's one thing to have problems and voice your concerns, but when you endlessly bitch day in and day out about the same tired old shit, it honestly makes me wonder why you are even here. Generally when somebody doesn't like something, they stop caring about it.

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  #27  
Old 07-28-2013, 06:04 AM
BaronGrackle BaronGrackle is offline

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Originally Posted by Revenant View Post
While it was not that way in Day of the Dragon, hill dwarves are now a synonym for Wildhammers and mountain dwarves are a synonym for Bronzebeards. Brann's Journal in the magazine clarifies/retcons this, and (not to be left out) the Dark Irons become the never-used-before dark dwarves. Also, Falstad says it if you click on him enough in Ironforge.
I was just reflecting on this the other day - ALL THREE of the major Dwarven clans are centered on or in a mountain.

~ ~ ~

Anyhoo, I would ask how modern lore treats Rom's group of freedom fighters (Bronzebeardy or Wildhammery), but I'm pretty sure modern lore doesn't have dwarven freedom fighters in Khaz Modan after the Second War. In current continuity, Khaz Modan is reclaimed in the closing days of the war (with Deeprun Tram in construction phase as early as BtDP times, 8 ADP).

And Grim Batol, instead of being a well-known Horde bastion and center for launching dragon raids against continental Lordaeron... is instead a secret that survives so long only because the Alliance doesn't know the Dragonmaw are still there.

http://www.wowpedia.org/The_Battle_o...y_of_Warcraft)
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Originally Posted by The Battle of Grim Batol
However, unknown to the Alliance, a large force of orcs still roamed free in the northern wastes of Khaz Modan. The Dragonmaw Clan, led by the infamous warlock Nekros, was using an ancient artifact known as the Demon Soul to control the Dragonqueen, Alexstrasza, and her dragonflight. With the Dragonqueen as his hostage, Nekros built up a secret army within the abandoned - some say cursed - Wildhammer stronghold of Grim Batol.

Last edited by BaronGrackle; 07-28-2013 at 07:50 AM..
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  #28  
Old 08-01-2013, 04:54 AM
Avon Avon is offline

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Moira should offer to use her son and some blood magic to rid the place of it's curse as a show of good faith between clans. Falstad should think there's no point and Muaradin should side with Moira stating the need for a stronghold in the region. The three clans could then move in and clean up what ever remains. After that they move on to Shadowforge!
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  #29  
Old 08-01-2013, 06:47 AM
Trickster Trickster is offline

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Isn't that place in ruins after the battle of the Bastion of Twilight/Grim Batol dungeon? And I would imagine the Dragonmaw wouldn't pass on the opportunity of capturing it. The place should be a battlefield by now. Unless the Red Dragonflight decided they want to keep it.
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  #30  
Old 08-01-2013, 10:17 AM
Thunderbraid Thunderbraid is offline

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Moira should offer to use her son and some blood magic to rid the place of it's curse as a show of good faith between clans. Falstad should think there's no point and Muaradin should side with Moira stating the need for a stronghold in the region. The three clans could then move in and clean up what ever remains. After that they move on to Shadowforge!
That was my idea for Grim Batol!

The Wildhammers and Dark Irons haven't made up yet, really. So if the Dark Irons got their magic wielders together and put their minds to the task they could probably dispel Modgud's curse - They may even know what it was to make the task easier.

Whilst the Aerie Peak Wildhammers have shown no interest in Grim Batol, there is a significant portion of Wildhammers who do. Grim Batol could become a city made up of equal parts Bronzebeards, Wildhammers and Dark Irons.

That means:

Ironforge is majority Bronzebeard.

Shadowforge is majority Dark Iron.

Aerie Peak is majority Wildhammer.

Grim Batol is even split between the three - And potentially the capital of the Khaz Modan Empire when Dagran II comes of age.

Very nice symmetry and it gives cause for the Wildhammers to also trust Dark Irons more.

Last edited by Thunderbraid; 08-01-2013 at 10:34 AM..
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  #31  
Old 08-01-2013, 12:18 PM
Mutterscrawl Mutterscrawl is offline

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Grim batol needs to be dismantled the place is -cursed-. It's got faceless and troggs bearing "Modgud's Malice".
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  #32  
Old 08-01-2013, 12:21 PM
Kir the Wizard Kir the Wizard is offline

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So, about that Old God somewhere under Khaz Modan...
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  #33  
Old 08-01-2013, 02:13 PM
Thunderbraid Thunderbraid is offline

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Originally Posted by Skytotem View Post
Grim batol needs to be dismantled the place is -cursed-. It's got faceless and troggs bearing "Modgud's Malice".
Congratulations on not reading what I typed.
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  #34  
Old 08-01-2013, 02:17 PM
Mutterscrawl Mutterscrawl is offline

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Congratulations on not reading what I typed.
Didn't see it till now.

Still, one doesn't just 'dispel' old god corruption.
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  #35  
Old 08-01-2013, 02:25 PM
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Did Somebody Say Northeron!?


(psst, look below Quel'Thalas label)

For what it's worth, despite this map putting it super high up, I'm pretty sure the entire "Northern Lordaeron" region was meant to be Northeron. That includes Alterac, Hinterlands, "Eastern Plaguelands" and maybe Arathi.
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  #36  
Old 08-01-2013, 03:01 PM
Thunderbraid Thunderbraid is offline

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Quote:
Originally Posted by Skytotem View Post
Didn't see it till now.

Still, one doesn't just 'dispel' old god corruption.
Modgud's curse is not Old God corruption.

Old God corruption can also be removed. Case in point: Ulduar.
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  #37  
Old 08-01-2013, 03:04 PM
Mutterscrawl Mutterscrawl is offline

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Originally Posted by Thunderbraid View Post
Modgud's curse is not Old God corruption.

Old God corruption can also be removed. Case in point: Ulduar.
It might be, there was a faceless general in there after all. She might've been "Twilight's Hammer" before there was a Twilights Hammer if you get what I mean.

We haven't exactly seen the state of the lower rooms and such since Yog's death.
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  #38  
Old 08-01-2013, 03:07 PM
Thunderbraid Thunderbraid is offline

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Originally Posted by Skytotem View Post
It might be, there was a faceless general in there after all. She might've been "Twilight's Hammer" before there was a Twilights Hammer if you get what I mean.

We haven't exactly seen the state of the lower rooms and such since Yog's death.
And as far as I remember that Faceless General, and all of the Twilight's Hammer/Old God inhabitants were slain. There's also nothing to back up the claim that Modgud was in league with the Old Gods. She was fully in league with her husband and the Dark Irons. The curse she cast on Grim Batol was one of her own design and thus, Dark Iron design. Making the Dark Irons best placed to dispel it.

Well, seeing how there's been no more Old God minions flooding out of the place I think it would be reasonable to assume it has been cleansed.

And logical.
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  #39  
Old 08-01-2013, 03:08 PM
Mutterscrawl Mutterscrawl is offline

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And as far as I remember that Faceless General, and all of the Twilight's Hammer/Old God inhabitants were slain.

Well, seeing how there's been no more Old God minions flooding out of the place I think it would be reasonable to assume it has been cleansed.

And logical.
I thought the whole point of old god taint was that it lingered after they were dead?
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  #40  
Old 08-01-2013, 03:09 PM
Thunderbraid Thunderbraid is offline

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Originally Posted by Skytotem View Post
I thought the whole point of old god taint was that it lingered after they were dead?
There was no Old God in Grim Batol?

There is no evidence of their minions leaving taint.
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  #41  
Old 08-01-2013, 03:12 PM
Mutterscrawl Mutterscrawl is offline

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There was no Old God in Grim Batol?

There is no evidence of their minions leaving taint.
That's a fair point, it's always been the blood.
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  #42  
Old 08-01-2013, 03:13 PM
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Originally Posted by BaronGrackle View Post
I was just reflecting on this the other day - ALL THREE of the major Dwarven clans are centered on or in a mountain.

~ ~ ~

Anyhoo, I would ask how modern lore treats Rom's group of freedom fighters (Bronzebeardy or Wildhammery), but I'm pretty sure modern lore doesn't have dwarven freedom fighters in Khaz Modan after the Second War. In current continuity, Khaz Modan is reclaimed in the closing days of the war (with Deeprun Tram in construction phase as early as BtDP times, 8 ADP).

And Grim Batol, instead of being a well-known Horde bastion and center for launching dragon raids against continental Lordaeron... is instead a secret that survives so long only because the Alliance doesn't know the Dragonmaw are still there.

http://www.wowpedia.org/The_Battle_o...y_of_Warcraft)
It would make the most sense to just make them Wildhammers. I know the book sort of contradicts this (and it was probably not Knaak's intention) but it makes more sense with modern lore given the entire Twilight Highlands region being a Wildhammer area. You can actually reconcile a lot of the gryphon jokes and appearance differences by thinking of them as an offshoot of the Wildhammers that either never used gryphons or gave them up when moving into Grim Batol (nevermind that some of the Twilight Highlands stuff kind of contradicts this, but maybe they sort of re-discovered a love for gryphons after the book ). They mock the Aerie Wildhammers for not being as sturdy as they are because the Aeries fly around everywhere while the "Hill Dwarves" stick to the ground.
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  #43  
Old 08-01-2013, 03:13 PM
Thunderbraid Thunderbraid is offline

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I may correct that to yes, powerful minions most likely leave some kind of scar, but I have a feeling it can be healed.

It's only Deathwing's blood that apparently causes things to not grow for 10,000 years where it falls. I imagine it's a trait unique to Deathwing.
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  #44  
Old 08-01-2013, 06:11 PM
Revenant Revenant is offline

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Originally Posted by Thunderbraid View Post
There was no Old God in Grim Batol?

There is no evidence of their minions leaving taint.
It probably could be cleansed if the plot called for it.

And yes, Old God minions do leave taint. Look at every Twilight's Hammer shrine and operation from vanilla to Cataclysm. Either they brought it or they were feeding off of it.
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  #45  
Old 08-01-2013, 07:05 PM
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I will always see Northeron as the "Meh. Don't have time. Let's say it was destroyed by the Cataclysm" zone. Kul'Tiras will follow, when the devs will remember it's existence.
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  #46  
Old 08-01-2013, 07:49 PM
Melorandor Melorandor is offline

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If the Three clans do reclaim Grim Batol(I do like the idea) what would become of the Dragonmaw clan?

Would they still back the Horde vice versa?

Will the Dragonmaw after Garrosh and Zaela's "departure" chose to live in peace with the Wildhammer?

What would the Three Clans do about the Dragonmaw in the area?
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  #47  
Old 08-01-2013, 08:19 PM
Trickster Trickster is offline

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Originally Posted by Melorandor View Post
If the Three clans do reclaim Grim Batol(I do like the idea) what would become of the Dragonmaw clan?

Would they still back the Horde vice versa?

Will the Dragonmaw after Garrosh and Zaela's "departure" chose to live in peace with the Wildhammer?

What would the Three Clans do about the Dragonmaw in the area?
Judging by the Strenght of Steel story, some Dragonmaw will still be part of the Horde.

As for the war against the Wildhammers, it will always be present. The Orcs just came in the zone and declared it was theirs while the Dwarves lived there for ages. Unless the Dragonmaw decides to go elsewhere, peace will never be a thing in that area.
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  #48  
Old 08-02-2013, 12:40 AM
Thunderbraid Thunderbraid is offline

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Quote:
Originally Posted by Melorandor View Post
If the Three clans do reclaim Grim Batol(I do like the idea) what would become of the Dragonmaw clan?

Would they still back the Horde vice versa?

Will the Dragonmaw after Garrosh and Zaela's "departure" chose to live in peace with the Wildhammer?

What would the Three Clans do about the Dragonmaw in the area?
Tell them to leave, hopefully. They're squatters.

Violent squatters who have repeatedly attacked the rightful denizens of that land.
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  #49  
Old 08-02-2013, 12:45 AM
Kir the Wizard Kir the Wizard is offline

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I think the Red Dragonflight intended to return to the fortress.

Quote:
For what it's worth, despite this map putting it super high up, I'm pretty sure the entire "Northern Lordaeron" region was meant to be Northeron. That includes Alterac, Hinterlands, "Eastern Plaguelands" and maybe Arathi.
Or it could have included what became "Aerie Peak" and 'the Hinterlands' in WC3 and WOW, respectively.
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  #50  
Old 08-02-2013, 07:34 AM
Kellick Kellick is offline

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Tell them to leave, hopefully. They're squatters.

Violent squatters who have repeatedly attacked the rightful denizens of that land.
There's actually no evidence the Dragonmaw have ever attacked the local Jellyneck tribe, so it's actually still possible they allied with the rightful denizens of the land against the violent squatters.
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